UK in/out referendum on the EU (Brexit vs Bremain)

I didn't think his opinions were inappropriate either. He is entitled to a personal opinion and at the end of his tenure he doesn't give a toss any more and just says what he thinks. What he said was sensible and measured, it certainly wasn't scare tactics, on the other hand Boris Johnson was well out of order mentioning Kenya. for fucks sake, he really showed himself up to be an ignoramus.

I agree that the Kenya comment was way out of line.

The reference to Brussels just makes it better. (The ECHR has nothing to do with Brussels, or the EU.)

{{{No but the Tories dont just want to take us out the EU, they want to take us out the Human Rights act too and create our own to replace it- apart form the fact a human rights act drawn up by tory toffs doesn't bear thinking about- it would cause considerable constitutional problems, as both the Scottish Parliament and the Northern Irish Assembly both have the human rights act and other European legislation written into their very fundamentals- I dont see how you can separate them without tearing down the institutions and rewriting them from base up}}}

"The Commision for example, all apointed, not elected."

Well, well done picking out the one major branch of the EU that is "all appointed, not elected." Let's not mention the Council, which represents the executive branches of the member states governments, or the European Parliment, which is elected, only people don't actually use their democratic right leading it to be filled by fringe elements.

What the EU does have an institutional issue with is that it skews the internal relationship between the different member states governemental branches, as the Council and the EU is a product of the executive branches of the member stats governments and their influence as well is larger with regards to parliment than it tends to be nationally. Further parlimentary control with the executive branches actions in the EU context often leaves much to be desired.

I think it will be a sad day if the UK leaves Europe.

{{{on the point of democracy in the EU- which it needs a lot more of, but not as urgently as it needs a lot more transparency and information made available- which rings me on to a question for all the other European members (though I know you Fjordians arent in it, exactly, but you still have to agree to a lot of the rules) and the question is this-

Does your daily national news tell you what's been going on in the European Parliament that day?


Because it doesn't in the UK. I couldn't even tell you the name of my MEP, and its not like I don't pay attention and have an interest in politics- its just you here nothing about what they are doing nothing about what is happening in the European Parliament unless its something huge or a disaster, or more commonly, both.
On the main 6pm UK news I get the UK Parliament, on the Scottish news which follows I get the Scottish Parliament- but not the European one.

So is it he same elsewhere, or is it a peculiarly British thing to be so poorly informed on the works of the Parliament on a daily basis? }}}}

In the US if it's outside the borders, it has to be on the level of Armeggedon or we don't hear of it.

Boris, stahp. What are you doing. Boris.

EU Referendum: Boris Johnson compares EU's aims to Hitler's - BBC News

The worst part is that there is a germ of an interesting point that deserves discussion in there, but by couching it in a Hitler comparison, Johnson weakens his own point (especially since the comparison makes no sense) and distracts from the actual issue. Are we sure he isn't secretly trying to sabotage the Leave campaign?

"But fundamentally what is lacking is the eternal problem, which is that there is no underlying loyalty to the idea of Europe.

"There is no single authority that anybody respects or understands. That is causing this massive democratic void."

For real though, this has become a serious problem with both the Eurozone debt crisis and the migrant crisis proving that the "common European identity" was pretty paper thin and that once things went south, a significant portion of both voters and politicians reverted to exclusively national allegiances rather than trying to stick together and help out the countries getting hit hardest. Seen also in the lack of democratic engagement with the European Parliament, which in addition to having poor turnout in the last 10-20 years, is clearly not highly regarded even by the people who do show up, given the number of hardcore euroskeptics and other fringe parties represented.

Faisal Islam. giving politicians shit since 2016.

Well of my four close relatives who I know are definitely registered to vote, three have already voted Leave by Postal Vote, and the fourth has been on the fence for weeks.

I'm almost 100% sure I'll be voting to remain, but given the apathy many younger people have, and a ever decreasing voter turn out I'm beginning to wonder if Leave might just win by default-if you are happy with the status quo there's arguably much less of an incentive to go out and campaign.

I've only seen Vote Leave campaigners canvassing local areas so far, but I live in a generally right-leaning areas anyway so that's not surprising...

{{{Much the same here Malick- in fact I came home tonight from work to find a flyer through my door for a Leave town hall style thing at the local Grammar School, and had plenty of leave propaganda through the door recently- almost nothing for Remain though.
From a Scottish perspective its nothing like the indie referendum, that was ll everyone talked about and argued about- the feeling I get now is apathy- most people seem to be treating it like a Tory infight that's nothing to do with them- and when it comes to the vote apathy seems pretty high up the list, followed by people voting how they knew they were going to before the talking about it ever started.
I've also noted a marked reduction in interest among my female work collegues compared to the indie referendum- this might be the profusion of white men in suits doing the arguing. That might change here a bit as Sturgeon is stepping up to campaign more for Remain on a UK stage starting with the big ITV debate.
I don't get the sense that there will be any great change of opinion like in the indie ref where Yes went from 22% to 45% (that shift is always why I dont get the resurgence on the remain side of Project Fear- they seem to thin it worked in Scotland, when the truth is it lost them a 23% lead. And the starting pint for in/out is near 50/50.) }}}

I think the remain campaign has been tragic so far, where is Corbyn? its unforgiveable. There is no neutral ground to trust, the newspapers are partisan, the Daily Mail is spewing immigration hate, as if by leaving the EU we can stop millions of people coming from outside Europe, which is what is having the most dramatic effect on our culture, At least the European migrants learn English and don't practice FGM. Its not Europeans we have to worry about, and what the hell is Farage on about the UK becoming like Cologne? They were north Africans, its just scaremongering. All we need is for Dave to draw up some restrictions on immigration like the Ozzy point system, tighten up the borders which he can do without us having to leave Europe and those are the main concerns of the public sorted.  even if the Chuckle brothers (Boris/Michael/Nigel) do win, they ARE NOT IN POWER so they can promise all they like, if they are not PM its a waste of time. As for economic arguments, ALL  the major financial people have said its a massive risk to the economy, anyone who ignores that is an idiot.

I just had to go & click on the other vids I listened to the one about weird recorded noises. I still not sure what to think but its fun watching & hearing ideas of what these sounds could be.

well the Pound has taken a nose dive. well done Boris!

If Brittain leave will the Chunnel need to be back filled?

yes. Nigel has his spade ready.

If Brexit happens I am going to become Italian. fuck it. I give up. Its too embarrassing to admit being part of a nation of idiots.

Popped into town to meet a friend, once again only LEAVE were campaigning, almost all of the supporters seemed to be 40+, none of my friends are voting Leave as far as I know.

I'm starting to think it will be a repeat of 2014 with the older generations' votes cancelling out those of the younger generation.

young people need to wake up and vote Remain because its you lot who are going to suffer most.
and what on earth is going to happen in Ireland? are there going to be internal borders between a European Ireland and a UK Northern Ireland, how would that work, you would need a passport, it would tear people apart.
I saw the debate in an Irish university with Blair and John Major, they were very good. It make me realise how bad the Tories have got when John Major starts looking like a nice decent chap. I remember when he was PM and the Tories were engulfed in sleaze scandals and Mad Cow desease. happy days.

OMG no more cheap European travel. that's just the pits.