Re: The Bigger, Badder, Even More Serious Thread [4]

[Pettytyrant101]

More cover ups in the Westminster paedophilia cases coming to light- this time regarding the late MP Cyril Smith.

Turns out he was investigated 3 times, the evidence was compelling, there was in the view of those investigating an overwhelming case for prosecution, and all three times the high ups put a stop to the case going any further.
The first two investgations were in the 60's and ended when the detective leading the case was told by a magistrate that there would be '"unfortunate repercussions for the police force and the town of Rochdale" should he (Cyril Smith) be prosecuted.
The same magistrate also told the detective- it was "no secret" that he and Smith "are buddies, and not only politically".

During the third and final investigation Det Sgt Jack Tasker, who was in charge, claims senior officers 'ordered him to hand over notes and "[They said] we must keep out of Rochdale and we must not speak to anyone about the Cyril Smith inquiry or we would be in serious trouble" if he continued the investigation.
He believes many other men were involved in the abuse and the Smith investigations were only "scratching the surface".
"It was obvious that someone quite high up, quite powerful, was making sure that Cyril Smith never appeared before a court."



Murkier and murkier.

[Mrs Figg]

its like an episode of Prime Suspect without the laughs.

[Pettytyrant101]

According to reports today HAMAS has fired 50 rockets into Israel- striking, nothing at all and causing no damage whatsoever as they were all intercepted.
Meanwhile Israel have terrorised and displaced thousands of Palestinian civilians from their homes and murdered a further 500+
And if history is anything to go on the ground currently under Israeli army feet will stay that way and the Palestinians will never see it again.

Anyone else feel this is a bit of a problem?

Surely its about time western countries like the US and UK told them enough is enough- this stops or your cash and support stops.

[David H]

Yeah, I even heard a soundbite where an Israeli official referred to the invasion to weaken Hamas as "mowing the grass".

I'll give Israel credit for the major effort that's been made to reduce civilian casualties considering all the bombing and shooting they've been doing, but nothing justifies all of the nonlethal damage they've done to every part of Palestinian life. It just makes peace that much more difficult.

It's come to the point where Likud and Hamas need each other to justify their existence, and the USA and the UK are enabling Israel's Extreme Right while Iran and others are enabling Palestine's Extreme Right,v while the moderates and liberals take the beating.

And it seems to be getting worse rather than better, especially with the changes in Egypt. We gotta find another model!

[Pettytyrant101]

It always seems to be the same story- the majority are the poor bastards currently trying to flee a war zone with nowhere to go.

And the West give funding to the Palestinian side as well. I just think if everyone who is providing the cash and supplies should just said thats it, no more- theyd have to sort out something else or both states would collapse.

[Mrs Figg]

shooting the Palestinians is like shooting fish in a pond, theres nowhere for them to hide, its disgusting and if we dont stop Israel its genocide and its our fault. I want the West to stop pandering to Israeli aggression and arrogance get the settlers out of Palestinian lands tear that bloody wall down, and the next time they go on about the holocaust, just tell them they are the Nazis now.

[Pettytyrant101]

I was trying really hard to not say that Mrs Figg.

But now you have I find it hard to disagree with you.

[Mrs Figg]

wheres the understanding and the compassion?

[Pettytyrant101]

Its hard to see Israel as the good guys that's for sure- I was watching Newsnight earlier they had footage shot by some young Palestinian friends, in their 20's. One of their friends had just been shot in the hand by an Israeli sniper and they were tying to work out how to get to him (he was about 15 feet away, lying on his back showing them his shot hand) but they never got a chance- they shot him dead as he lay there helpless.

Israel says its there to destroy the Hamas tunnels, so you have to wonder why they shelled the shit out of a Palestinian hospital, or what they are doing sniping civilians.

But the US will just keep throwing the cash and arms at Israel- Israel are the worlds 4th largest military fighting a nation who wouldn't make the top 1000 probably.
To quote War of the worlds, its bows against the lightning.

I also note Israel claiming that their have been so many civilian causalities (over 500 dead nearly 4000 wounded so far) because Hamas use civilian as shields- where the buggery are civilians meant to go to get away then when they are confined to narrow strips of land hemmed in by walls and people who will shoot them if they try to get out?

And just to be clear, in case we have any Jewish members (I have no idea) this a problem with Israel- the State and its actions. Not the people, most of whom I suspect, like everyone else, just want a safe life. But they are not going to get one whilst the Israeli government commits atrocities in the name of the jewish people, all that does is risk isolation and rising anti-Semitism.

[Mrs Figg]

Hamas are hardly a threat to the military of Israel, and the ordinary Palestinians dont want to be killed in their name. But the Israelis seem to be using Hamas as more of a good excuse to attack, hit hard and then scale down aggression when it suits.

[halfwise]

The way Israel has responded to the shelling has been a mixed bag. They always respond with a heavy hand and often the soldiers on the ground go overboard, but in this case they have at least tried things like calling civilians before they bomb, or doing the 'warning knock' before the real shell. The problem of course is that the warning knock tends to make people hit the floor rather than run, and getting a warning telephone call is more likely to make the recipient stand there with the receiver in his hand going "what the F&*k was THAT?"

The Israelis do try, but their whole approach has been so wrong headed from the start (I'm talking 60 years) that there's really no solution left for them. It's like America in Iraq - all the good intentions and nation building attempts would never work. Once a wrong of that magnitude has been committed there's nothing left that works anymore.

[Pettytyrant101]

like calling civilians before they bomb, or doing the 'warning knock' before the real shell.- Halfwise

And not much use if you have nowhere to go, nowhere to get food, clean water, toilets and you cant even flee the country because some evil bugger has walled you in.

[Pettytyrant101]

Just listened to an interview with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu on the situation in Palestine and with Hamas in which he said 'they dont care about life.'

Now thats a slippery slope-once you start demonising a people as less than human any crime can be committed against them- the Jewish people above all should know this as demonising Jews as subhuman is an old trick perpetuated against them in the past.

Very uncomfortable hearing those words from an Israeli PM.
Cant they hear themselves?

[halfwise]

At least leaders like Ariel Sharon had respect for his opponents, and got some in return. Netanyahu deserves none.

[chris63]

shooting the Palestinians is like shooting fish in a pond, theres nowhere for them to hide, its disgusting and if we dont stop Israel its genocide and its our fault. I want the West to stop pandering to Israeli aggression and arrogance get the settlers out of Palestinian lands tear that bloody wall down, and the next time they go on about the holocaust, just tell them they are the Nazis now.

Well said.

[chris63]

Israeli flag being remove in Dublin Ireland. Respect to the Irish ✊

[chris63]

Israeli flag being remove in Dublin Ireland. Respect to the Irish ✊

[Eldorion]

Unfortunately anti-war demonstrators in Israel are facing attacks from local far-right groups. I remember the Iraq War and I know how lonely it is to be anti-war in a country that's been whipped into a militaristic mood (although I was very young and only anti-war because of my parents' religious affiliation). We were never attacked at protests or anything, though. That I can't imagine.

http://972mag.com/the-night-it-became-dangerous-to-demonstrate-in-tel-aviv/93524/

[Mrs Figg]

some guy on the news said that Israel keeps the Palestinians thin and angry instead of fat and happy and thats why the two countries will hate each other and kill each other for the next millenium. If the Israelis traded, and opened their border, and generally treated Palestinians as respected neighbours non of this bloody genocide would be necessary. Its fucking lunacy.

[Pettytyrant101]

Its not lunacy if you need rid of the Palestinians so you can steal their land, take control of the Temple Mound, destroy the Dome of the Rock and rebuild Solomon's Temple there and restore Israel to its historic boundaries, and so create the conditions for the coming of the Messiah as promised.

Ok that is lunacy, but sadly that doesn't mean they dont believe it!

[Mrs Figg]

 

[Pettytyrant101]

It just keep sgetting worse.

'At least 649 Palestinians and 31 Israelis have been killed. The UN says about 74% of those killed in Gaza are civilians, with medical clinics among the facilities hit by air strikes.
Kyung-wha Kang, the assistant secretary-general at the UN Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs, said civilians in Gaza had no safe to place to go "as 44% of the land has been declared a 'no-go zone' by the Israeli army".
"Families are taking the heart-wrenching decision to split to different locations - mother and son to one; father and daughter to another - hoping to maximise the chance one part of the family survives."
Navi Pillay, the UN's top human rights official has condemned Israel's military actions in the Gaza Strip, saying that war crimes may have been committed.'- BBC

And Israel's response?

'Israel's Justice Minister, Tzipi Livni, described the UN Human Rights Council as an "anti-Israel" body.'

Maybe its anti-Israeli because you are committing war crimes against a civilian population!

[David H]

The FAA ban and the number of airlines choosing not to fly to Ben Gurion International Airport will unfortunately make it even more of a target for Hamas missiles, but it is probably one of the least violent ways of bringing it home to the hardline Israelis that there are consequences to war.

[Mrs Figg]

Its not really the Holy Land anymore is it.

[azriel]

For a place so rich in history & religion its never known peace or stopped being at war. Is this really what religion is all about ?