Re: The Desolation of Smaug pre-release thread [3] [SPOILERS]

by Radaghast Fri Dec 06, 2013 2:37 am

bungobaggins wrote:
Recoveryanonymous wrote:
Radaghast wrote:Yeah, go make King Kong vs. Mecha-Godzilla or something.
Really though, it's clear that's the kind of movie he wants to make; I don't know why he chooses source material that he has to fight with in order to get there. He needs to work on Pacific Rim or something similar.
He needs to make another cheesy horror film.

Yeah! Meet the Feebles 2!

by bungobaggins Fri Dec 06, 2013 2:42 am

Eldorion wrote:Okay, honestly, I was thinking about this the other day. I know that "make it an HBO miniseries!" is the preferred method for hypothetically adapting The Silmarillion, especially since Game of Thrones became a big hit, but I don't think it would work. It doesn't get around the fact that The Silmarillion is not a novel, barely has a coherent plot, and has characters appear and drop away constantly. If you were going to try to adapt The Silmarillion, I think the best bet would be to copy the Marvel Cinematic Universe. You can have stand-alone movies and/or self-contained duologies and trilogies for specific storylines, like the Feanor's rebellion, Beren and Luthien, etc. Every now and then there are giant crossover movies that tie together the various story pieces and anchor the whole franchise. Since the timeline is way more spread out than the MCU, these movies might be the transitions between different individual storylines. The most obvious candidates for the subject of the mega movies would be the principle Battles of Beleriand.

Honestly, this would still probably be a gigantic mess, and I'd rather that The Silmarillion not be adapted at all, but I think this would be the best of many possible bad approaches.

The thing about HBO is that, I don't have access to it, and I'm not going to pay for it. And yes, there is no coherent plot, so the whole thing would be a mess anyway.

But even if they did try the Marvel approach, those stories wouldn't be able to fit the fan obsessed 3 hour length, would they?

by RA Fri Dec 06, 2013 2:43 am

Is PJ in the equation?

by bungobaggins Fri Dec 06, 2013 2:45 am

I bet if he wasn't then a good portion of the fan base would turn their back on the project.

by Radaghast Fri Dec 06, 2013 2:48 am

I don't think The Silmarillion is filmable either. It's more of an anthology than a single story, even though the stories happen in sequence.

So, fuck OFF, Peter Jackson!

by RA Fri Dec 06, 2013 3:04 am

by Eldorion Fri Dec 06, 2013 3:04 am

bungobaggins wrote:The thing about HBO is that, I don't have access to it, and I'm not going to pay for it. And yes, there is no coherent plot, so the whole thing would be a mess anyway.

But even if they did try the Marvel approach, those stories wouldn't be able to fit the fan obsessed 3 hour length, would they?

Beren and Luthien could probably be made into a three hour movie. The Fall of Gondolin and The Children of Hurin would be harder, largely due to the longer time-frames and multi-generational casts. It could probably be done, but they don't lend themselves to the blockbuster model. Beren and Luthien is a little more conventional in that way.

by Eldorion Fri Dec 06, 2013 3:06 am

Recoveryanonymous wrote:Is PJ in the equation?

Hopefully not. Razz

I'm not sure how much he'd really want to be, either.

by Radaghast Fri Dec 06, 2013 3:09 am

Eldorion wrote:Beren and Luthien is a little more conventional in that way.

I'm hoping to see the novelization of Beren and Luthien.

by Eldorion Fri Dec 06, 2013 3:12 am

That would be neat. The Tolkien Estate has said that they won't be publishing anything like that since there isn't enough material to go on. So Children of Hurin will be our only spin-off novel from The Silmarillion, it seems.

On this topic, I really wish that Tolkien had continued his rewrite of The Fall of Gondolin. What we have in Unfinished Tales is really good, and it's even more frustrating since the only complete version of the story is from the 1910s and contains all sorts of Book of Lost Tales-era weirdness.

by Radaghast Fri Dec 06, 2013 3:14 am

It's funny, but we have the LotR to thank for his not finishing that stuff.

by bungobaggins Fri Dec 06, 2013 3:38 am

Here's an elaboration and context about Thranduil's scar.

Spoiler:

http://newboards.theonering.net/forum/gforum/perl/gforum.cgi?post=675826#675826

by Radaghast Fri Dec 06, 2013 3:39 am

by Forest Shepherd Fri Dec 06, 2013 3:57 am

Strange stuff there, with Thranduil's scar. (I mean, when was Thranduil around dragons?) I must have missed the first mention of it on this thread: can't seem to find it.

Last night I was reading through some more of the upcoming film details, and I realized that, emotionally, I was and have been incredibly let down by book-to-movie adaptations of my two most cherished book series: The Hobbit, and The Chronicles of Narnia: such willful stupidity in nearly every scene, such poorly executed emotional highs and lows, complete misinterpretations of cherished sequences. It drags you down if you let it.

On the other hand, I did enjoy the Harry Potter films a lot, as well as Sherlock, so it's not as if everything in sight is grey and dismal.
I remember seeing the The Goblet of Fire and feeling that same emotion you get when you see friends after a long separation. I felt included and, strangely enough, liked. (Which is exactly how the books made me feel, growing up). I hadn't seen the second and third yet, which mostly explains that separation of time feeling.

But with these Hobbit movies, and the Chronicles of Narnia, I feel so letdown and tricked, as if the ideal version in my head has been intentionally undermined by those involved. It's a mean thing to do, to put out work that so clearly distorts whole generation's worth of imagination.

Consider how Doctor Who fans would feel if a new doctor came along that used guns, killed off enemies without a thought, and slept around with all his companions!
Mad

by Radaghast Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:00 am

I too thought CoN:LWW was awful. I've only seen parts of the second movie, but what I saw looked awful as well.

by Eldorion Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:05 am

Forest Shepherd wrote:Strange stuff there, with Thranduil's scar. (I mean, when was Thranduil around dragons?) I must have missed the first mention of it on this thread: can't seem to find it.

That's what I was wondering, too. Didn't we already see Thranduil turn his giant moose around and leave at the first sight of the dragon? scratch

Consider how Doctor Who fans would feel if a new doctor came along that used guns, killed off enemies without a thought, and slept around with all his companions!

You mean, what if the Doctor was James Bond? I'd watch that! Very Happy

by bungobaggins Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:08 am

I'm fairly positive that Lee Pace mentioned in an interview that Thrandy was part of the "Serpent Wars" and had fought dragons. More made up stuff I would assume.

by Radaghast Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:10 am

Oh sweet Ilúvatar, please make it STOP!!!

Mad

by bungobaggins Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:12 am

It never stops. Evil or Very Mad

by Radaghast Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:17 am

by Eldorion Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:18 am

bungobaggins wrote:I'm fairly positive that Lee Pace mentioned in an interview that Thrandy was part of the "Serpent Wars" and had fought dragons. More made up stuff I would assume.

First I've heard of that, but a few minutes on Google and...

Lee Pace wrote:He’s more complex, he’s very complex. Maybe because I’m the actor who plays him, I understand him and I agree with him. I agree with everything he does. In the prologue, he turns away when the dragon comes. Would you do any differently? This is a dragon. He knows. He’s fought dragons, he was part of the big serpent wars, he knows how hard they are to kill.

Source (courtesy of Heirs of Durin and the Thranduilings tumblr)

This is close to an "attacks were made on Rivendell" moment. Laughing

My best guess is that this invented conflict has something to do with the dragons of the Withered Heath, which is fairly close to northern Mirkwood and was the main abode of dragons after the First Age.

by Radaghast Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:33 am

Lee Pace wrote:He’s more complex, he’s very complex. Maybe because I’m the actor who plays him, I understand him and I agree with him. I agree with everything he does. In the prologue, he turns away when the dragon comes. Would you do any differently? This is a dragon. He knows. He’s fought dragons, he was part of the big serpent wars, he knows how hard they are to kill.

Oh, go make Marmaduke 2, why don't you? Mad

by Tinuviel Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:41 am

Yeah, what? Serpent Wars? Is that some vague, uninformed reference to the Silmarillion, or a lie told to him by PJ for a reason for his character to have a scar. Though now that I think of it, I remember seeing it while he's fighting in (Laketown?)

by Radaghast Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:54 am

Yeah, the dwarves knew how hard dragons are to kill too. That's why they never tried...until PJ came along with his stupid molten gold malarkey.

by Tinuviel Fri Dec 06, 2013 5:09 am

http://barrelescape.thehobbit.com/
There's a new game called "Barrel Escape" on the movie website. I just played it, and it's pretty fun. I mean, they filmed the damn thing like a video game, so it makes sense. You're Kili the entire time, so I wonder what that can tell us about the movie. But there's lots of fighting on the river, next to the river, and even in the river!!!