Doctor Who [3]
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Pettytyrant101 Mon Oct 01, 2012 7:34 pm
The Full Official viewing figures are in for Power of Three and including I-player the grand figure is-
8.67 million
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Norc Mon Oct 01, 2012 8:02 pm
Pettytyrant101 wrote:I apoligise for this vid in advance (and it contains complete spoilers for the episode)- as it may leave you in tears (I refuse to comment on my own response to it
Amarie- Waters of Mars is a favourite of mine- the two Doctors one- I like the two doctors thing and the interaction- but the plot- the victorian children and the god-awful Cyberking stomping about Victorian London- thank goodness the Cracks in TIme ate that one from history- nice one Moff!
![Doctor Who [3] - Page 26 Tumblr_mb13klzlci1rucyx2](https://2img.net/h/media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mb13klzlci1rucyx2.jpg)
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Pettytyrant101 Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:12 am
Sorry Norc- I expect man more sad vids to come.
I watched 11th Hour back again and it seemed som much more tragic and sad than before. For the first time ever in my entire time of watching Who in relation to a companion, when the Doctor materialises at Amy's I thought- just don't- leave her alone- you are going to screw her up so badly you might never get over the guilt.
Anyway- here's a behind the scenes on the Angels episode and those final scenes.
I watched 11th Hour back again and it seemed som much more tragic and sad than before. For the first time ever in my entire time of watching Who in relation to a companion, when the Doctor materialises at Amy's I thought- just don't- leave her alone- you are going to screw her up so badly you might never get over the guilt.
Anyway- here's a behind the scenes on the Angels episode and those final scenes.
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Pettytyrant101 Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:25 am
Some more Ponds tribute vids.
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Pettytyrant101 Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:36 am
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Tinuviel Tue Oct 02, 2012 6:39 am
Love the signature Norc 
I love Star Kid!
What bugs me most about the final episode is the "angel that got away" and just shows up. It seemed like it was Moffat trying to be clever but instead it came off as "seriously? wtf! how could one have survived!" and then Poof! Rory was gone! Then so was Amy and that was that. I don't like next to no closure. The forward thing just wasn't enough for me. I'm starting to get sick of Moffat. Just a bit. He needs to know it's ok to have a simple plot once in a while. Everything doesn't need to be so smart! Because pretty soon smart becomes stupid!!!!
There, that's my Buckie rant
but I'm not satisfied! 
I love Star Kid!What bugs me most about the final episode is the "angel that got away" and just shows up. It seemed like it was Moffat trying to be clever but instead it came off as "seriously? wtf! how could one have survived!" and then Poof! Rory was gone! Then so was Amy and that was that. I don't like next to no closure. The forward thing just wasn't enough for me. I'm starting to get sick of Moffat. Just a bit. He needs to know it's ok to have a simple plot once in a while. Everything doesn't need to be so smart! Because pretty soon smart becomes stupid!!!!
There, that's my Buckie rant
but I'm not satisfied! _________________
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Norc Tue Oct 02, 2012 8:33 am
yeah, it was a surprise ending, but I kind of liked it. I was like YEY they made it! wait, wasn't this supposed to be the ponds last ep? Oh moffat you troll! *rory desappears* WHAT! NO!! ... Amy.. no.. noooooooooooooooo...
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Pettytyrant101 Tue Oct 02, 2012 1:17 pm
'What bugs me most about the final episode is the "angel that got away" and just shows up.wtf! how could one have survived!" ..'- Tin
ps saw this post over on Gallifrey Base that seemed to sum up entirely the attitude in the UK to Doctor Who and what age your child should watch it at;
'My 7 year old son is still too scared to go to bed at night due to watching this. Brilliant!'
So if you want to know if your child is old enough for Who its easy enough- if it scares the crap out of them, they're old enough.![Doctor Who [3] - Page 26 1067764964](https://2img.net/u/1813/32/54/71/smiles/1067764964.gif)
- Spoiler:
- The Tardis is locked in a loop with the events at the cemetary- when it bounces off 1938 it materalises back in the present day- but in the wrong place- in the cemetary- Amy asks why there and the Doctor replies its probably a causality thing not to worry about- at the end of the scene the camera pans down and reveals the link is Rory's name on the gravestone. But thats not all it shows-
![Doctor Who [3] - Page 26 Vlcsnap-2012-10-02-13h06m30s240](https://2img.net/h/i1011.photobucket.com/albums/af236/pettytyrant101/vlcsnap-2012-10-02-13h06m30s240.png)
There is an Angel in the cemetary too- and as it zapping Rory is part of the causality the Tardis and the headstone is also locked into that Angel is not part of the paradox.
The double ending worked well for me- the roftop scene is about showing just how much they really do love each other and what they are prepared to do for one another and to be together- to jump- not just to give up travelling with the Doctor but everything if necessary. Just so long as whatever they do, its together.
When Rory is zapped there is no other decision Amy would ever make- the rooftop proves that- but the Rory scene is both where the Doctor is confronted with that truth and where Amy gets to say goodbye. I found it entriely satisfying for both staying true to the characters and for keeping to the themes of the last 3 series.
Its not a sad ending for Amy or Rory- they get each other- all they ever really needed- the pain and the sadness is the Doctors-right from the begining with Amy this was his fault and yet since his grand-daughter left the Tardis this is the first time he has had a real family- not friends, not companions, but a family- and now he has lost that too.
Thats the pain of the Lonely God.
edit- also the Doctor is incredibly selfish at the end- its him that cant conceive of going on without Amy- that cant face the pain he knows he will feel at her loss in his life. He even lies when he tells her there is no way to know if she will be sent back to the same time (he knows she will as shown in Blink when the cop gets caught by the same Angel as got the Doctor and Martha and gets sent to the same time period).
This is a side to the Doctor, the side that taunted him in Amy's Choice as the Dream Lord. The side that told Amy the truth in God Complex- "I stole your childhood and now I've led you by the hand to your death. But the worst thing is I knew. I knew this would happen. This is what always happens. Forget your faith in me. I took you with me because I was vain. Because I wanted to be adored"
This is the Doctor we see for the latter half of the Angels episode. He is too selfish and emotional to deal with what is happening. Remember Amy telling him back in the Doctors Wife not to get emotional- that its when he gets emotional he makes mistakes, gets blinded?
In the final scene he begs Amy not go, but contrast that with River's response;
Amy: But it's my best shot, yeah?
The Doctor: No!
River: Doctor, shut up! Yes, yes, it is!
One of the reasons I love this scene is the Doctor in it- in many ways this is him at is worst, at his most vulnerable and selfish- and all becuase he is in so much pain, the one thing he can't deal with and from which he is always running.
ps saw this post over on Gallifrey Base that seemed to sum up entirely the attitude in the UK to Doctor Who and what age your child should watch it at;
'My 7 year old son is still too scared to go to bed at night due to watching this. Brilliant!'
So if you want to know if your child is old enough for Who its easy enough- if it scares the crap out of them, they're old enough.
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Norc Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:09 pm
- Spoiler:
- and yet since his grand-daughter left the Tardis this is the first time he has had a real family
grand-daughter? WHAT?
btw... how do you analyze all that and make it into text? why didn't I think i\of all that?
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Pettytyrant101 Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:15 pm
When the 1st Doctor stole the Tardis and fled Gallifrey he took his granddaughter Susan with him. She and two of her teachers from the school the Doctor put Susan into (Barbera and Ian) were the first companions. The Doctor choose to leave Susan behind on earth after she fell in love with a human during a Dalek Invasion (As you do). Other than the 5 Doctors special in which she is temporarly pulled from time we have never heard anything more about her ever since.
Last edited by Pettytyrant101 on Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Norc Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:18 pm
HE HAS A GRAND-DAUGHTER! HE HAS HAD CHILDREN! WHAT? HOW! DID HE KNOW HOW?
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Pettytyrant101 Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:28 pm
He had a whole family back on Gallifrey- only the Great Houses had Looms to produce offspring. If you remember the 10th doctor and the Master talking about Gallifrey the Master recalls running all day in the grass fields of the Doctors family estates.
So Susan though is granddaughter gentically would have been loomed like him. None of that messy sex business which is probably why Time Lords seem to have so little interest in sex, they havent had to do it for reproduction for millenia.
And in the 10th Doctor story where the Time Lords return the most likely contender, based on hints from RTD who wrote it, was that the older woman Will keeps seeing and who covers her face at the end is the Doctors mother.
So Susan though is granddaughter gentically would have been loomed like him. None of that messy sex business which is probably why Time Lords seem to have so little interest in sex, they havent had to do it for reproduction for millenia.
And in the 10th Doctor story where the Time Lords return the most likely contender, based on hints from RTD who wrote it, was that the older woman Will keeps seeing and who covers her face at the end is the Doctors mother.
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Pettytyrant101 Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:37 pm
Why weird?
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Pettytyrant101 Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:58 pm
Mmm, never struck me as odd, I suppose because I've been aware of it for a long time, before NuWho.
But you've got to remember its been about 1000 years now for the Doctor since Susan left.
But you've got to remember its been about 1000 years now for the Doctor since Susan left.
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Tinuviel Wed Oct 03, 2012 1:17 am
One more thing about saturday's episode; Couldn't the doctor just go to 1939 or 1940 to see the ponds again?
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Pettytyrant101 Wed Oct 03, 2012 1:29 am
There are a few reasons Tin-
- Spoiler:
- Remember the premise set up in the story about things being written in stone?
The Doctor reads Amy's Afterword, and she and Rory are dead by this point of old age, and in it she tells him they lived happily. And that this is the end of her story.
The Doctor isnt in it. So if he does go back for them he would be creating another paradox in an already fractured space time.
Secondly the Doctor tells Amy if she does it it will become a fixed point in time- and we saw at the end of last season what happens if you break a fixed point- time itself collapses and fractures.
But the main reason is much like Gallifrey- he could go back and try to do something but he chooses not to- the entire series has been about the torn lives of the Ponds- travel with the Doctor or normal life together- Amy and Rory choose each other in that episode- they choose the normal life.
And look what happened when he tried to go find out about Melody- it took him 200 years- Amy does not want him to do that to himself trying to recapture the past when she and Rory are happy together.
She wants him to move on and not to travel alone.
River clearly manages to at least get the book to Amy for publication but as that is already part of the causal effect- the book exists in the future- that would not break the fixed point as it is part of events. But the Doctor seeing them would break it, so he can never see them again- not without huge risk all round anyway.
But its quite possible River does manage to visit them again at some point.
When it comes to time and space getting screwed in Doctor Who its not only the place and time more the people involved in the paradox that are the problem- so it wouldn't matter if the Doctor tried to meet them in Boston or in a different year somewhere- it would still break the fixed point of them never meeting again.
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Pettytyrant101 Wed Oct 03, 2012 1:46 am
It struck me watching the episode back how alike Amy and River really are. They both in the end would choose self sacrifice for the man they love. Amy does so for Rory and River for the Doctor.
In a sense Rivers choice in the Library is a reinactment of the act she saw her mother make for her father. I find that rather wonderful and touching.
In a sense Rivers choice in the Library is a reinactment of the act she saw her mother make for her father. I find that rather wonderful and touching.
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Gandalf's Beard Wed Oct 03, 2012 11:42 am
I'm still boycotting Dr Who. 
Bloody writers. Bastards.
Bloody writers. Bastards.
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Gandalf's Beard Wed Oct 03, 2012 1:22 pm
Because the writer's ruined the Doctor's love life and married Amy Pond off to her idiot boyfriend Rory. Pissed me off to no end.
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Gandalf's Beard Wed Oct 03, 2012 3:24 pm
1) Have you SEEN Rory? He's as big an idiot as Rose's idiot boyfriend. At least SHE had the good sense to dump Mickey and get it on with the Dr.
2) Which was fantastic until the writers got rid of Rose in a tragic story-line. I nearly had a conniption then.
3) Amy Pond is Fucking Adorable and I love her.
There was a real chemistry between the Dr and Amy that is entirely lacking in Amy's relationship with Rory.
4) The writers married her off to the generic moron instead of giving the Dr a break in his love life. The Doctor is ancient, tragic, and lonely (to which I can relate
). It's about time he had a nice stable relationship without all the angst for a bit.
5) Riversong is NOT Fucking Adorable, and thus a poor substitute.
I have loyally watched Dr Who practically since its inception (for over 40 years). I'm done until the writers quit jerking the Doctor around. For God's Sake; the man has FEELINGS.
At least SHE had the good sense to dump Mickey and get it on with the Dr.2) Which was fantastic until the writers got rid of Rose in a tragic story-line. I nearly had a conniption then.
3) Amy Pond is Fucking Adorable and I love her.
There was a real chemistry between the Dr and Amy that is entirely lacking in Amy's relationship with Rory. 4) The writers married her off to the generic moron instead of giving the Dr a break in his love life. The Doctor is ancient, tragic, and lonely (to which I can relate
). It's about time he had a nice stable relationship without all the angst for a bit.5) Riversong is NOT Fucking Adorable, and thus a poor substitute.
I have loyally watched Dr Who practically since its inception (for over 40 years). I'm done until the writers quit jerking the Doctor around. For God's Sake; the man has FEELINGS.
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https://www.fanfiction.net/s/5678122/1/The-Adventures-of-Bilbo-and-Tauriel
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Re: Doctor Who [3]
by Pettytyrant101 Wed Oct 03, 2012 3:34 pm
His feelings are the whole point GB- they gave him a family again- the one thing he has not had since Susan left.
They gave him love through River (and lets face it if he ever was going to marry it was always going to be under crazy Who circumstances such as the timey-wimey part Time-Lord space/time anomaly that is River Song- I always found his so called releationship with Rose to be both shallow and seriously dodgy- she is a child to him- he has nearly 900 years on her its ridiculous and a bit unsavoury).
That Amy never loved the Doctor in that fashion is truelly refreshing- that she loves another and in the end will choose him over the Doctor in a heartbeat was also hugely refreshing.
I have no idea why you dislike Rory so much, you'll have to explain that one - he's the best male companion since Harry and the 4th Doctor, and before that Jamie with 2 and Ian with 1, in my view- he is easily head and shoulders the best male companion of NuWho- the development of his character from begining to end is the most growth ever shown in a Who companion in the shows entire history (I dare you to come up with a male companion who develops more in the course of their run).
Rory also has a far more honest view of the Doctor than most- he gets him- and therefore what a danger he can represent- and even more refreshingly Rory isnt even there for the Doctor- he is there because Amy wants to be there.
I can easily say Rory is one of my all time favourite companions.
And he punched Hitler!
They gave him love through River (and lets face it if he ever was going to marry it was always going to be under crazy Who circumstances such as the timey-wimey part Time-Lord space/time anomaly that is River Song- I always found his so called releationship with Rose to be both shallow and seriously dodgy- she is a child to him- he has nearly 900 years on her its ridiculous and a bit unsavoury).
That Amy never loved the Doctor in that fashion is truelly refreshing- that she loves another and in the end will choose him over the Doctor in a heartbeat was also hugely refreshing.
I have no idea why you dislike Rory so much, you'll have to explain that one - he's the best male companion since Harry and the 4th Doctor, and before that Jamie with 2 and Ian with 1, in my view- he is easily head and shoulders the best male companion of NuWho- the development of his character from begining to end is the most growth ever shown in a Who companion in the shows entire history (I dare you to come up with a male companion who develops more in the course of their run).
Rory also has a far more honest view of the Doctor than most- he gets him- and therefore what a danger he can represent- and even more refreshingly Rory isnt even there for the Doctor- he is there because Amy wants to be there.
I can easily say Rory is one of my all time favourite companions.
And he punched Hitler!
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