Holidays and absences

I would say that the number of women who flaunt their bodies as an act of feminism  are small compared to the number of women who feel they can flaunt their bodies because of feminism.

The first group is saying the must be respected because they are women, the second group is saying they must be respected no matter what, so may as well use their female attributes to get stuff.  It's a subtle difference, but I feel more aligned with the second group.  

I think we're well past the point where women are ashamed to be women, and don't think it's any more wrong for them to use sexual attraction as a money/fame tool than  for a man to use physical strength as a money/fame tool.  It's not demeaning for men in general if a few of them go off on the brute force lunkhead route; if a few women go off on the bimbo route I don't think the culture as a whole is judging women based on that.  Not anymore, at least.  There's a plethora of other role models out there.

Oddly enough I was about to post something much like Mrs Figg has Eldo- men can sympathise, empathise and cheerlead from the side lines- but it isnt our fight for the very good reason we dont actually know whats its like to be a woman in this world so dont really know what the fight is.

I do disagree however Mrs Figg with your belief that women who exploit themselves for profit do not see themselves as feminists or are in some way betraying feminism.
I suspect some of them might view you as an old fashioned feminist- and the new crop see no reason why a woman should not only control her life, but control being oggled too. Doing it on her terms.
There are woman who run porn companies after all, successful businesses- are they exploiting other woman or are they feminists?

I agree with your overall position Halfy- but not with the notion there are other role models out there- how many people could name 2 top female scientists? Two top female business women? Two top female astronauts ect.
Role models might be out there but they are not being presented as such. What young girls are being presented with is a conveyer belt of identikit females whose fame soley derives from their sexuality.

We could use more Danica McKellars out there. She totally defines what the modern woman should be in every sense.  

Quick google image search there. Ah, young, cute, sexy, half naked and smart. Just the role model I want for my daughter. There just isn't enough pressure to be best at everything already.

''I do disagree however Mrs Figg with your belief that women who exploit themselves for profit do not see themselves as feminists or are in some way betraying feminism.
I suspect some of them might view you as an old fashioned feminist- and the new crop see no reason why a woman should not only control her life, but control being oggled too. Doing it on her terms''. Petty

old fashioned feminist?  really? sneer much?
well feminists like me see that pandering to the male gaze by getting naked does not empower a woman in the least, if someone lays herself bare in front of a lecherous crowd, who has the power the men or the woman? the woman is basically selling her flesh letting herself be examined from all angles like a slab of meat, I fail to see how that gives her power she lies there like a patient going to have a smear test, all her dignity and mystery gone forever, the men have the power either to buy her or leave her when the next hot model turns up for consumption, this is not feminism the women are buying into a myth, a lie, they want money and their only asset is their bodies like a prostitute uses hers. Its a warped kind of power entirely on male terms, snide comments about being an old fashioned feminist doesnt cut much water, its either equality without exploitation or its not equality at all, its pandering to patriarchy. people that insist that women showing their bodies are in some way expressing feminist ideals are deluded. are bimbos respected? are they fuck, they are generally derided as thick slappers, they are unthreatening to men they are in their place, grinning decorative playthings, if in some twisted way men think this is the 'new face of feminism today they are not being honest and are pretty dangerous they are perpetuating a lie, the young girls who think its cool to strip are being conned, they wont be respected or taken seriously they will be seen as cheap tarts by the media who feeds on them and spits them out when the next willing victim Wanders into the trap.

this whole thread got norced

 

'' I would say that the number of women who flaunt their bodies as an act of feminism are small compared to the number of women who feel they can flaunt their bodies because of feminism.'' Halfwise

the ONLY women who can flaunt their bodies in the name of feminism with any real meaning are Inna Shevchenko FEMEN girls and Pussy Riot.

Norc wrote:this whole thread got norced

Poor Squach. She came back to announce her reappearance, and she got a Norced thread.

You get used to it eventually

I wasnt sneering Mrs Figg- I was raising the possibility there might be a generational gap between your idea of feminism and the sort seeming to be practiced by the younger generation.
As your own posts show its a tricky topic without seeming to be preaching one view or another- you yourself just said -
'the ONLY women who can flaunt their bodies in the name of feminism with any real meaning are Inna Shevchenko FEMEN girls and Pussy Riot.'-
which on the surface appears to put yourself as the ultimate arbitrator of what is truly feminism and what is not.
You dismiss all the women who may run their business affairs, book their own jobs, deal with their own finances and investments, chart their own career, just because the business they are in involves being sexually attractive. And that seems in your view to automatically disallow them from claiming any feminist position.
I just dont think women in those positions would agree that they are just airhead bimbos, whose poor little minds are too weak to notice that really they are just still being exploited by us cackling evil men.
That does somewhat seem a bit like sneering at them to me.

Sorry Squach!- Blame Mrs Figg, she knows damn well I wont fail to rise to her bait, every single time!

You make some good points, Mrs Figg, but I feel that at least among the people in this thread, you are looking down on women who dress revealingly more than any of the men here.

now you are deliberately misinterpreting my words so you can win an argument, cunning but it doesnt work or fool me. there is nothing wrong with being sexually attractive, I never said that as you well know. There is a world of difference between that and vulgar exhibitionism. Most women have to play the game to some extent, you dont get ugly female newscasters for example, thats just they way it is in this superficially equal world. But I am talking about Young minds being warped.
You obviously are on the side of misogynysts otherwise you would understand and sympathize with my point of view, instead you take cheap shots at me and seem to be arguing for the sake of getting a rise. you seem to think its funny. I dont.

Okay, change the words in my post to "vulgar exhibitionism" and the point still stands.  Some of the men here might drool over women who flaunt their bodies but I don't think they'd insult them.  Clearly there are plenty of men who do that but it's not an automatic thing.

And like I said, I think you make some good points here.  It's definitely problematic that women are required to be attractive to be in a profession such as news just because they're (inappropriately) expected to serve as eyecandy.  I'm not insulting you or your beliefs.

You obviously are on the side of misogynysts- Mrs Figg

I think you come to every such debate with me with this at the forefront of your mind.
All I am saying is that many of the women who do flaunt themselves shamelessly in vulgar exhibitionism do so in their own view as strong independent women making their own choices. And for them that is feminism.

Madonna is a good famous example- long held up as a fiercely independent women, who created her own carer and controlled it personally, and who made a fortune out of sexy videos and her SEX book.

I was talking to Petty

this forum is pretty lame, I wont be back any time soon.

Mrs Figg wrote:I was talking to Petty

Sorry, my bad.

this forum is pretty lame, I wont be back any time soon.

See you later.

halfwise wrote:

Norc wrote:this whole thread got norced

Poor Squach.  She came back to announce her reappearance, and she got a Norced thread.

at least i had nothing to do with it

You're just an Innorccent bystander

 

hey, I tried hard with that one.

Squach wrote:You're just an Innorccent bystander

 

 

Well done, Squach! I'm proud of you.

At least someone is ^_^