Re: We're all doomed! Doomed I say- the Corona virus thread for panicking in!

[halfwise]

90% is a game changer.  Will still take about 6 months to roll out after it's produced, so it ain't over yet.

[Mrs Figg]

They are saying it will be rolled out before Christmas in the UK for the medical workers and elderly, and early Spring for anyone else over 50. So I imagine as it is a US product it will be just the same for America. The problem is the fridges.

[Lancebloke]

I believe we have ordered 40 million doses, which means 20 million people in the first round... assuming it works.

We should soon know about a few of the others in the next couple of months too.

[halfwise]

You forget that Britain actually has a unified health system. Maybe 6 months is overly pessimistic for the US, but the initial roll-out will be done under Trump. Inspires confidence, doesn't it?

[Pettytyrant101]

{{ Do all you can to stay safe US members. According to the BBC youre about to top 250,000 dead and youve got a rate of 1000 Americans dying every day. And far as I can tell your covid resposne from the top is nonexistant. So take care of yourselves. }}

[Lancebloke]

Does anyone know if the US will be rolling any vaccine out for free or will insurance/payment be involved?

It will be interesting to see how this all goes.

I think that we could do with some proper vaccine related, informational media over the next few months. There is so much misinformation about vaccines, and therefore reluctance to actually have one, that I think a campaign of T.V adverts, newspaper columns etc explaining a lot of detail around what they are (e.g. ingredients), how they work (why the ingredients and how they were developed), how they were tested etc would be very beneficial. They should address some of the specific "claims" against them too.

[halfwise]

I believe it will be free.

[Mrs Figg]

thats a good idea to have an information campaign, the more absurd conspiracy theories need debunking asap. The Bill Gates one is barking mad, who believes that rubbish is beyond me.

[Lancebloke]

People believe rubbish because that is all they see and they see lots of it.

Don't get me wrong, there have been vaccines that have been rushed and caused damage so I understand people will ask questions. Just need people who know what they are talking about to answer them rather than armchair epidemiologists/virologists/etc.

[Mrs Figg]

There's another vaccine with 94% from Moderna, it is a US vaccine so the UK might not get it because the genius Matt Handcock didn't want to be part of the EU procurement thing. what a grinning idiot that man is.

[Lancebloke]

Well... I think we are signed up to 6 different vendors at the moment so I am not sure this one is a problem. Sputnik V has a 90% plus reported ability to protect (yet to be verified alongside those others) but not heard any complaints about not having any orders with them...?

Edit - looks like Hancock has ordered 5m doses.

[azriel]

[Mrs Figg]

omnishambles

[Pettytyrant101]

{{ Latest polling in Scotland from Ipso Mori on which adminstration is dealing with Covid best, makes bad reading if your Boris. }}

[azriel]

I accept that this was something new to wake up to but, Boris does not have the stomach, spine, balls, whatever to lift this country up under the armpits & say, " we'll fight this & this is what we are going to do". Im not buying that bollocks that " he did the best he could"..."it was new, what would anyone else have done ? " yadda yadda. Well, get their brains in gear would be the first thing ! I cant wait to see the back of him. He is a consistent liar & when he's not obviously lying he's lying under the cover of waffling, jovial banter thats endearing to some of the adult population, HUH !

[Mrs Figg]

Johnson is a lazy lying shyster and it is reflected in the terrible outcome. Jacinda Ardern is the complete opposite and now New Zealanders are living normal lives. She knew the same amount as Johnson but she took it seriously.

[halfwise]

Sweden seems to be abandoning it's laissez faire approach to Covid-19.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/swedish-government-sidelines-epidemiologist-steered-102636440.html

[Lancebloke]

{{ Latest polling in Scotland from Ipso Mori on which adminstration is dealing with Covid best, makes bad reading if your Boris. }}

But factually, the death rate in Scotland is higher than in England. Another case of people having an opinion based on no evidence or something else?

[halfwise]

From what I see they've been trading back and forth, and are so close in death and infection rates there's no good numerical basis to declare one's been doing much better than the other.

https://covid19.healthdata.org/united-kingdom/england?view=daily-deaths&tab=compare

(go up to the compare tab and delete everything except scotland)

[Lancebloke]

Scotland - Population = 5.46m
Deaths = 10285
% = 0.188

England - Population = 56.29m
Deaths = 103870
% = 0.184

So Scotland very slightly higher but negligible. Doesn't make sense then why the polls see Sturgeon as handling this far better (55% better!).

[Pettytyrant101]

{{ Theres a few reasons here Lance. Firstly the death rate is lower in Scotland-

'Scotland's Covid death rate is 94 per 100,000, compared to England's at 101.5 and Wales at 102.4.'- BBC

Spread of the virus is at much lower rates than it is in England too. So why the high death count? Well partly its poor health, Scotland is poorer and less healthy than England on average, and also how excess deaths are counted, with Scotland counting far more as covid related than how England calculates them.

'While the number of cases reported in Scotland rose rapidly in September and October, in general it has remained proportionately lower than in its southern neighbour.
Linda Bauld, professor of public health at Edinburgh university, said one factor could be the role of other illnesses in increasing vulnerability to Covid-19. “Scotland’s population is sicker on average,” she said.'

Then there is the huge gulf in style between Sturgeon and Boris. She gives daily breifings, they are calm, organised, she comes over as very genuine and caring and importantly as leading. compare to Boris shambling press briefings, uturns and changes of policy, clarifications, and cock ups like bullying Pratel or Cummings castle trip dont help give the impression of a leader in control during a pandemic.

'Prof Bauld said the UK generally had not coped well with coronavirus, but that in comparison with England, the Scottish government’s communication had been clearer and there was “some evidence of a somewhat better” public health system response.
“These are important differences, but they are modest,”... New case numbers have largely flattened out in Scotland over the past month while continuing to grow south of the border.
“Although the upturn of the exponential phase of the second wave has been quite similar in both [nations], we do seem to have brought it down quicker,” Prof Woolhouse said.- FT

So the overall impression is that she is more competent, has a better handle on events, and that she is treating the people fairly by giving us daily all the information she has.}}

[Lancebloke]

Where are you getting those figures from? The death rate is not lower in Scotland despite generally having harsher restrictions the England.

It also has less dense population centres than England and so the ability for the virus to spread should be lower.

Seems to me that because she seems like she had a plan and talks about it calmly that people think she does a better job regardless of whether the outcome is worse.

Edit - you may ask where I am getting my data from and that is a good bloody question as I cannot find my original source and just looking at my numbers above makes me wonder how the fuck I didnt notice an obvious error!!

Overall the number are lower in Scotland but it seems recent death rates are higher in Scotland by about 10 per 100k. That is data is can actually see now... not made up like my 110k deaths above!!!!!

[Pettytyrant101]

{{ Figures are from BBC Scotland and the Financial Times. Far as I can tell the main differences are in how Scotland records Covid deaths. And the other major factor is general health in the population,  its not a coincidence where the virus is highest poverty is too. A good example is difference between Edinburgh and Glasgow, Glasgow has far more cases and higher death rate, but standards of living, health of population and per person per square foot are all worse in Glasgow. Glasgow and surrounds has 33% of the entire population of Scotland living there.
So the virus has been spreading slower here than in England overall, in large part due to Sturgeons lockdowns and tier system, but the rate of deaths is higher from it, most likely down to a mix of health and living outcomes in the worst hit areas that preexisted the virus. The rate of death is only part of the story of whats going on, and why.}}

[Lancebloke]

Do you think that is a systemic issue because of the way through Scottish government have handled things leading up to this or an issue that stems from Westminster?

Doesn't the devolved government control how it spends in those things, obviously once it has the money allocated by UK government?

[Pettytyrant101]

{{Do you mean the underlying factors like povertry and poor health?
If so its mainly at Westminsters door, in that Scotlands poor health is an issue thats been recorded since we began recording it. Long before devolution. And in fact is a result of Westminister focusing spending on the south of England, comparable poor results can be found in northern England citties too.
Under the SNP poverty has seen a steady decline, but from a very high start, steps theyve taken such as pricing on tobacco and alcohol, banning smoking in public places ect have all helped improve the overall health of the nation (and every one of those policies were opposed and critised by the Tories).
The Tory program of austerity set things back seeing maassive increases in food bank use an the like.
But the general trend since devolution has been of a slow but steady overall improvement, whilst the situation was awful to start with its somewhere about very bad now in the poorest communitites.

'The Scottish rate (of poverty) has declined from 23% in the mid-1990s to a low of 18% between 2008 and 2013, before rising slightly to its current level (19%).- BBC}}