Re: The Bigger, Badder, Even More Serious Thread [4]

[Pettytyrant101]

While I don't necessarily trust the Israeli government with WMDs, their nuclear arsenal (which is basically an open secret) is not illegal since Israel never signed the Non-Proliferation Treaty. Same thing as with India and Pakistan.- Eldo

Wouldn't that also be true of Iran then? In which case if they do make some there is no justification for going in and taking them out militarily when we haven't with the other 'rogue' nuclear states.

[Eldorion]

Iran is a signatory of the NPT so them developing nuclear weapons would be illegal under that treaty.  Even the CIA is not convinced that Iran's nuclear program is military in nature, though.  And Iran (and every country) has a right to develop nuclear technology for civilian purposes.

That said, the justification for trying to halt Iran's nuclear program has pretty much always been "we don't like or trust them". Only the most extreme have advocated military action against Iran in order to stop them, though, and I find that a very unlikely scenario. We didn't invade North Korea to stop them getting nukes, though of course North Korea has a powerful neighbor in China, who undoubtedly doesn't want a full-blown US invasion on its doorstep.

[Pettytyrant101]

Yeah, does kind of look like a double standard still - we dont mind anyone we let have nuclear weapons have them, but if we dont like you, we wont let you.

[Pettytyrant101]

I hate this sort of thing, everyone wants to help out where they can but this sort of news just puts you off the whole thing and makes you wonder if anything is ethical any more-

"Millions of pounds donated to Comic Relief have been invested in shares in tobacco, alcohol and arms firms, BBC Panorama has learned.
It includes £630,000 in shares in arms firm BAE Systems and more than £300,000 in alcohol manufacturer Diageo.
The BBC has also seen evidence which suggests Save the Children censored criticism of energy firms to avoid upsetting corporate partners.
Despite its mission statement claiming it is committed to helping "people affected by conflict", in 2009 the charity had £630,000 invested in shares in weapons firm BAE Systems.
Comic Relief also had more than £300,000 invested in shares in the alcohol industry despite its mission statement saying it is "working to reduce alcohol misuse and minimise alcohol related harm".
The majority was invested in Diageo, which manufactures dozens of alcoholic drinks and was recently criticised by the Health Select Committee for exploiting weaknesses in the regulation of alcohol advertising.
While raising funds in 2009, nearly £3m of Comic Relief money was invested in shares in tobacco companies.
Comic Relief has now changed the way it presents its accounts and it is currently impossible for the public to tell which funds the charity currently invests in.
It declined to comment on whether any money invested since 2009 is in shares in alcohol, arms, or tobacco companies.
Comic Relief said its approach is within regulatory guidelines."- BBC

    

[halfwise]

Charities should not be investing in stocks or bonds. If they do, they are not charities. Full stop.

[Eldorion]

They just have to keep their money in a savings account, then?

Smart, conservative investing by a charity can help them increase the amount of funds they have to work with. I don't really have a problem with it. But obviously there are some fields that don't make much sense to invest in for certain kinds of charities.

[Pettytyrant101]

I agree Halfy- they should not be making corporate investments like that.

Eldo its fine for them to invest in companies set up to dispense dugs, bring aid ect but arms dealers, alcohol and tobacco?- three of the main things the charity aims to help fight?

Wasnt sure where to put this, but figured its more general news than it is about TH-

"Sir Ian McKellen has said he was advised "not to go to Russia" by the Foreign Office because of the country's homosexuality laws.
"That's why I can't go... they couldn't protect me from those laws," Sir Ian, 74, told the Radio Times.
"Two and a half hours from London! In the land of Tchaikovsky, Diaghilev, Rudolf Nureyev - gay artists whose sexuality informed their work."
The actor came out as being gay at the age of 49.
The actor also hit back at comments made by Homeland star Damian Lewis in a Guardian interview earlier this year.
Lewis said he did not want to end up "as one of those slightly over-the-top, fruity actors who would have an illustrious career on stage, but wouldn't start getting any kind of film work until I was 50 and then start playing wizards".

Sir Ian told the magazine: "So he feels sorry for me, does he? Well, I'm very happy, he needn't worry about me".
However, he went on to say: "To rebut it, I wouldn't like to have been one of those actors who hit stardom quite early on and expected it to continue and was stuck doing scripts that I didn't particularly like just to keep the income up.
I've always wanted to get better as an actor. And I have got better. You've only got to see my early work to see that."- BBC

Regarding the "fruity voice" comment, Sir Ian said: "Well, it may be a voice that is trained like an opera singer's voice: to fill a large space. It is unnatural."

[Eldorion]

Eldo its fine for them to invest in companies set up to dispense dugs, bring aid ect but arms dealers, alcohol and tobacco?- three of the main things the charity aims to help fight?

That's why I said there are some things that don't make sense to invest in; ie, industries that your charity is ostensibly morally opposed to.

I know the Quaker meeting I used to belong to, which did a lot of charity work in addition to its religious activities, had pretty strict rules about what sort of companies and funds the meeting could invest in. The rules all had to do with various Quaker moral beliefs; for example, they couldn't invest in any company that had military contracts since Quakers are pacifists.

[halfwise]

Once a charity starts on the road to investment, how do they stay away from morally okay but risky stocks such as what happened in the tech bubble a dozen years ago?

Okay, I shouldn't have said bonds, since those are fixed income.  But stocks of any kind should be off limits.  People gave them money to be used, not invested with any risk whatsoever.  How would you feel if you gave money to a 'charity' which is supposed to be feeding children, only to find what you gave them has dropped 30% in value because of a bad investment?

So yes, the money should go into a savings account or something equivalent. Have we already forgotten the stock plummet of 2007-8?!

[Lancebloke]

Talking of charities... I had requested that the challenge I am doing next year to be linked to Comic Relief. I had even spoken to them about it. The company I am doing it through need to get authorisation from the charity so that the funds I raise go to them. Well, got an email yesterday saying Comic Relief weren't happy about me raising funds for them because they didn't orgainse the event. WTF? Is that not the most stupid thing?

[azriel]

Probably cos they cant control whats happening. Worried about dodgy money flow, worried noses will stick to far in & find out any scam they got going. I believe where there's money,there's inevitably corruption, whatever the scale is how far you want to take it.

[Pettytyrant101]

That sucks Lance- nothing worse than trying to help out and being snubbed for your efforts- hardly encouraging is it?   

[Mrs Figg]

that sucks Lance. good for you for trying though.

[Eldorion]

Britain destroyed records of colonial crimes - The Guardian

Not exactly shocking, but much more recent than many people would like to admit.

[Pettytyrant101]

I want to pay a tribute to someone I greatly admire and not enough people know- Baroness Trumpington of Sandwich.
I first saw her being interviewed many years ago on a programme about Bletchley Park (where during the war our top scientific minds worked, decoding the enigma machine among other important breakthroughs).
She is now 91 and was on Jack Whitehalls programme last night- she continues to impress me with her humanity, her sense of humour and the very real feeling that at 91 she hasnt changed a bit since somewhere in her 20's.

From wiki-

Educated privately, she left school aged 15 having never taken an exam. She was then sent to Paris to study art and literature.
Initially during World War II she was a member of the Women's Land Army attached to Lloyd George's Sussex arable farm, lodging with his then secretary/mistress and later wife Frances Stevenson.She then worked in naval intelligence at Bletchley Park, making use of her knowledge of the German language.

Baroness Trumpington gave a V-sign to Lord King of Bridgwater in the House of Lords on 10 November 2011 when he referred to her advanced age during a Remembrance Day debate.

In December 2012, she joined in supporting a posthumous pardon for Alan Turing with Stephen Hawking, the physicist, and nine others including Lord Rees, the astronomer royal, and Sir Paul Nurse, the head of the Royal Society and formerly of Rockefeller University. In a letter to the Daily Telegraph, the signatories called on Prime Minister David Cameron to support the pardon for Turing's 1952 conviction for homosexuality. The Baroness worked for Turing during the war at Bletchley Park. He died in 1954.

As a castaway on Desert Island Discs in 1990 she chose as her luxury item the Crown Jewels, in order to maximise her chances of being rescued.'

Here she is, aged 90 on Have I got News For You-



And giving two fingers to Lord King of Bridgwater for saying she reminds him how old the survivors of WW2 now look-

[halfwise]

I'd admire her just for her name.

[Pettytyrant101]

She prefers to be called Trumpy.   

[Eldorion]

I want to pay a tribute to someone I greatly admire and not enough people know- Baroness Trumpington of Sandwich.

I have to be honest, I stopped reading right here because there is no way that someone with such a ridiculously stereotypical English name could actually exist in the real world.

[Mrs Figg]

I have always admired her vim and verve, I kind of want to be like her if I get that old. She is brilliant., and I based my avatar Lady Trumpington Figg on her as a tribute.

[Pettytyrant101]

 Figgs. I should have known you would be aware of who she is. A very fine woman indeed. {{{Both of you}}}

[Amarië]

She sounds like my kind of lady.

she joined in supporting a posthumous pardon for Alan Turing

[Lady Trumpington Figgs]

 Figgs. I should have known you would be aware of who she is. A very fine woman indeed.  {{{Both of you}}}

Indeed Young man I am an exceedingly fine lady! good show old bean.
As for that hussy Mrs Figgs! well she calls herself Mrs but I doubt she's got a respectable bone in her body Pshaw!

[halfwise]

I want to pay a tribute to someone I greatly admire and not enough people know- Baroness Trumpington of Sandwich.

I have to be honest, I stopped reading right here because there is no way that someone with such a ridiculously stereotypical English name could actually exist in the real world.

I wonder if the English even hear it as funny. It may be something missing from their mental framework, you know, sort of what they do with 'R's. No clue, the lot of them.

[Bluebottle]

Figg has a sockpuppet?   

Should I say look out Orwell?  

[azriel]

Well, Ive just heard on the BBC news about Rolf Harris being accused of child, or at least alleged child, molestation. He didnt look very happy in the brief shot we had of him. Its still a big surprise to me over this, especially IF it is true ! Apparently hes denying it & claiming innocence but still, even the mere hint of sexual impropriety has marked him & my view of him.