Re: The Desolation of Smaug pre-release thread [3] [SPOILERS]

[Eldorion]

I can see your point Eldo. It's almost as if he plays Legolas wooden at least a bit on purpose.  

Yeah, I don't think the woodenness in LOTR was intentional, but it's sort of like they've written themselves into a corner with Legolas in The Hobbit.  He has to be dull and uninteresting or else his character won't make sense to someone watching the films for the first time in chronological order. This is a common problem with movie prequels in general, and a big part of the reason why I'm disappointed that they went in such a typical prequely route with TH.

Didn't the second Matrix movie end on a cliffhanger?

Yeah, that was another really bad one.  My understanding is that the storyline of the Matrix sequels was supposed to be a single film, with the trilogy being rounded out by a prequel showing the original rise of the machines.  But the studio nixed the prequel idea (which eventually became "The Second Renaissance" short in the excellent Animatrix), while the sequel story got stretched out way past its breaking point.  Not unlike The Hobbit.

[Tinuviel]

I thought Evangeline Lily did nicely. I feel like she really felt she needed to try extra hard because her character isn't cannon, that and she loves the source material quite a bit. It looks like Orlando has had some CGI work done to his face, like botox or something. It doesn't look natural. And his ears are way shorter than Tauriel's.

It's kind of sad, but I think Tauriel will be what keeps this film from being flushed down the toilet.

[bungobaggins]

I think there could be some other good things in the movie. Smaug could be good, Bilbo's moment with Smaug if they don't fuck up the dialogue (oh, wait, they probably already did), Lee Pace could deliver a good performance, Ian McKellen will be brilliant of course (as long as he isn't telling people to run the entire time).

I don't think I'll be able to handle Gandalf interacting with Azog, though. It's just not going to compute with my brain.

[halfwise]

I think Gandalf, a bald pale Azog, and a wrinkled Thorin the dwarf will all be killed and end up at the close of the movie in a blue flickering haze smiling down benevolently at the rest of the cast while the remaining dwarves sing and dance merrily around them....no wait, wrong movie.

[Sinister71]

Also, it's time for me to eat crow about the whole movie breaking point thing.  I was pretty vocal in my belief that DOS would include Smaug's death, because I thought doing otherwise would create a ridiculous cliffhanger. PJ has seemed averse to those so far, most noticeable in TTT when he drags the ending on and on trying to give it some sort of resolution.  However, assuming the reports from the IMDb boards are true, Smaug will not die in this movie.  So it appears that I was wrong. :)I do think it's going to be one of the most ridiculous mid-trilogy cliffhangers ever seen, though.

well i was right again    

[bungobaggins]

I think Gandalf, a bald pale Azog, and a wrinkled Thorin the dwarf will all be killed and end up at the close of the movie in a blue flickering haze smiling down benevolently at the rest of the cast while the remaining dwarves sing and dance merrily around them....no wait, wrong movie.

In 20 years when Jackson edits the movies for the umpteenth anniversary release, he'll have to go back and change Gandalf to a CGI robot, because that was his original vision the whole time.  

[bungobaggins]

Also, it's time for me to eat crow about the whole movie breaking point thing.  I was pretty vocal in my belief that DOS would include Smaug's death, because I thought doing otherwise would create a ridiculous cliffhanger. PJ has seemed averse to those so far, most noticeable in TTT when he drags the ending on and on trying to give it some sort of resolution.  However, assuming the reports from the IMDb boards are true, Smaug will not die in this movie.  So it appears that I was wrong. :)I do think it's going to be one of the most ridiculous mid-trilogy cliffhangers ever seen, though.

well i was right again    

It was pretty clear that they couldn't kill off Smaug in this film. To build him up the entire time and then kill him off after 30 minutes (or however long he appears on screen) would have been pretty disappointing. Plus the reaction among audiences who aren't familiar with the book might have been, "Well, the dragon was killed, is that the end of the story? Wait. There's another movie? But why? They killed the dragon, I thought that was the whole point."

This way they can hold off on killing him and get audiences to come back and waste 12 dollars next year.

[Eldorion]

Instead we just get a movie where they travel towards the mountain (which they saw at the end of the first movie) and fight the dragon, only to have him fly off and then ... cut to credits. It's the very definition of the "middle movie problem" where nothing happens but a lot of going from point A to point B.

If only they had stuck with the two movie idea this wouldn't even be an issue.

[Sinister71]

Instead we just get a movie where they travel towards the mountain (which they saw at the end of the first movie) and fight the dragon, only to have him fly off and then ... cut to credits.  It's the very definition of the "middle movie problem" where nothing happens but a lot of going from point A to point B.

If only they had stuck with the two movie idea this wouldn't even be an issue.

2 movies would have been a much better set of films, there would have been less room for made up Peter Jackson fan fiction, and it might have stuck a bit closer to the source material. Unfortunately Peter Jackson saw an opportunity to milk every middle earth idea he could out it the "appendices" knowing that he will probably never be going back there again.

[Radaghast]

This way they can hold off on killing him and get audiences to come back and waste 12 dollars next year.

One movie...for the price of three!

[bungobaggins]

New clip.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=663542687009494

Added youtube clip for easier watching.

[bungobaggins]

Partial clip that we saw a few weeks ago, now in higher definition, and not filmed with a potato.

[Sinister71]

Sorry but I still despise the fact that they are making the Hobbit all about Sauron and his return to power instead of being about the dwarfs reclaiming their treasure. We already had 3 movies about Sauron and his attempt to take over middle earth. Not to mention dropping so many hints about the ring that Helen Keller can see them.... Jackson has no clue... NOT ONE     

[bungobaggins]

[bungobaggins]

Yet another clip.

[Forest Shepherd]

Wow! I step away for a day, and all hell has broken loose.

First off, EGADS, add some special super-dooper mega-spoiler tags to that junk Eldo. One little click and the film's mysterious ending is completely spoiled for me. Way beyond the usual pale of spoiler. I don't like that, not one bit.  

Also, about Lurtz. I like his role in the movie. It's fine, and I enjoy seeing a one-on-one chance for Aragorn to show just how much more skilled he is at sword-play than some jumped-up un-washed over-blown cocky jerk of an Uruk. The problem I have is that fellow fans say "Lurtz" and expect me to know who the heck that is; from, apparently, the movie alone. It's worse if the fellow fan gets all fanboyish about the Uruk in question. Oh wait, oops.  

To clarify. The scene of Boromir's being shot with arrows is itself shot in slow-motion. The "polite wait" that the Uruks seem to be taking for Boromir is nothing more than the time it takes for them to reach him in the slowed-down pace of the frames per second. The reason that he is only hit by arrows when no Uruk is in front of him is simply because it is then that no uruk is in front him, allowing a clean shot for "Lurtz". Finally, you have to admit that in the book we get descriptions of how the orcs are afraid to attack Boromir, even once he begins being shot with arrows. This hesitance may be what one can see in the movie.

In response to that latest video posted by Bungo: this is pretty big if you think about it. We are shown black people in Middle-Earth for the first time! This addition is odd, but at least makes more sense than not, considering how far Esgaroth is towards the East. (It's an interesting change, but not necessary to my mind).

Edit: And I don't want to come across as an elitist caucasian wanting to keep non-Europeans out of Middle-Earth, but I've spotted a few Eskimo-looking types in the crowd as well. Lake-town is quite the mixing pot! (strangely).

[Johnnyd]

Lake town look like a play stage on the video look to fake.

[Forest Shepherd]

Can I just add that the decision to not watch this film due to a dislike of the content therein is so utterly incomprehensible to me that I cannot even begin to fathom it. I could never see myself in the position that I would not go see a movie adaptation of a favourite book of mine because of the drastic changes therein.
Heck, I saw all of the Chronicles of Narnia movies in theatres. Enough said right there...

Lake town look like a play stage on the video look to fake.

Hi, welcome Johnnyd.
And yes, it does look like a stage, but then again it is in the midst of a wooden town.

I thought it was funny how one older woman shakes her head when Bard mentions the "fire-storm" in Dale; as if she was around then!

[Johnnyd]

Thanxs Forest Shepherd yea it look kinda fake am sure the Dos going look more like donkey kong 4 with the jumping of the barrels orcs swinging from trees and elfs jumping from tree to tree.

[Radaghast]

Wow! I step away for a day, and all hell has broken loose.
To clarify. The scene of Boromir's being shot with arrows is itself shot in slow-motion. The "polite wait" that the Uruks seem to be taking for Boromir is nothing more than the time it takes for them to reach him in the slowed-down pace of the frames per second. The reason that he is only hit by arrows when no Uruk is in front of him is simply because it is then that no uruk is in front him, allowing a clean shot for "Lurtz". Finally, you have to admit that in the book we get descriptions of how the orcs are afraid to attack Boromir, even once he begins being shot with arrows. This hesitance may be what one can see in the movie.

I've considered this, but it just doesn't come across that way to me. If the orcs are afraid to attack Boromir, they should be more so when attacking them than when he's standing there shellshocked. And, he should be less surprised after the first arrow.

In any case, as I said, I'm sure I'm in the minority on this. I'm sure most see it as you've described it.

Re: the "clean shot", I never disputed that Lurtz should have been able to shoot Boromir, so I'm a bit confused by that bit.

[Radaghast]

Welcome, JD!

[Sinister71]

In response to that latest video posted by Bungo: this is pretty big if you think about it. We are shown black people in Middle-Earth for the first time! This addition is odd, but at least makes more sense than not, considering how far Esgaroth is towards the East. (It's an interesting change, but not necessary to my mind).

Edit: And I don't want to come across as an elitist caucasian wanting to keep non-Europeans out of Middle-Earth, but I've spotted a few Eskimo-looking types in the crowd as well. Lake-town is quite the mixing pot! (strangely).

For me the sad fact is they are in the forefront to appease people who got on Jackson's back a couple of years ago, because a woman of color went to audition for a role as a hobbit and was told they were looking for caucasians. She made a whole big stink about it on her facebook page and it went viral. I'm sorry but a story has to have set boundaries and a world set in a medieval English setting would not have black people, at least in any positive way. I'm not racist by any means but if the story is about something which doesn't have people of color, or gays, or WOMEN, they don't need to change things for them to be there in the foreground just to show how PC the film makers are. If the film had called for say black shop keepers in Laketown I could care less but all they are doing is trying to play up to a demographic who was upset because one of their own was told they weren't what the producers were looking for and cried racism. If it was originally written that way I'm fine with laketown being a mixing pot. But with all the people of color in the foreground it just looks like pandering to me, I actually like the idea of laketown being a melting pot but mix the people up and not put or focus heavily on people who are not caucasian.

On a different note I thought the scene was alright, not great. I thought Bard was well played though

[Johnnyd]

The hobbit have been taking over by Pc police and feminist and holloywood.

[halfwise]

I think this film needs some product placement. Cram should be replaced with Nature Valley granola bars. If it had miruvor (a sad omission from LotR) it could be replaced with Red Bull. This would make the silliness sadly but comfortingly complete.

[Sinister71]

you mean you didn't notice the bottles in Thranduil's wine cellar? They clearly say  Redbull right on them its just written in elvish