Lord of the Rings Humour: Parodies, Satires and More

Mrs Figg wrote:You seem to be missing my point, they were making a last stand, they were a juicy bait, it was meant to be obvious to Sauron, the whole point was to draw him out and take his attention away from Frodo, which worked a treat. Farting about on hills was no use at all, it would have delayed the inevitable by very little seeing as Sauron had vast armies probably outside the Gate as well as in. Plus they werent sure if Frodo was even alive or captured, Aragorn probably thought that if this was the end, they may as well go out with some dignity, head on and defiant, better to meet him before the gate than in dribs and drabs in the hills.

I think that's part of the difference from the book (as Petty has been trying to say, I believe). The Battle of the Black Gate wasn't supposed to be a suicide mission in the book. It was a desperate gamble, sure, and everyone involved knew there was a very good chance that they would all be slaughtered, but it wasn't as fatalistic as in the films. However, PJ seems to have a thing for fatalism, since he upped the level of it in the films considerably. With that in mind, movie!Aragorn's suicide charge makes sense, but for the book character it wouldn't have made sense. I'll refrain from weighing in on the question of whether movie!Aragorn or book!Aragorn is superior since I think I've made my thoughts on that clear in other threads.

That is indeed my point Eldo but also a little more, which is that it does not only contradict the book but PJ's own film and what passes in his adaption for the Last Debate chapter.
In it the plan they come up with is essentially the same as the book- to draw the eye and Saurons forces away from Frodo for as long a spossible to give Frodo a chance. This is in PJ's film yet what follows does not make any sense if that is the plan, which is typical of PJ's cavalier approach. He puts stuff in that is the book plot because he has to then completely ignores it when he wants to do his on exciting over the top thing. But what he actually does is undermines the books credibility and plotting and constistency of actions and characters.

yawn.

I'm not sure if I agree that it creates inconsistency. In PJ's Last Debate scene I got the feeling that the characters all thought of what they were doing as a suicide mission and had no expectation whatsoever of living to see success, even if Frodo did succeed. That's just how I interpreted it and I could be wrong, but it was the sense I got from the scene. Different from the book, clearly, but not necessarily internally inconsistent.

On the other hand, maybe PJ just wanted a cool-looking and "dramatic" charge at the last battle and I'm putting more thought into this matter than he did.

Mrs Figg wrote:You seem to be missing my point, they were making a last stand, they were a juicy bait, it was meant to be obvious to Sauron, the whole point was to draw him out and take his attention away from Frodo, which worked a treat. Farting about on hills was no use at all, it would have delayed the inevitable by very little seeing as Sauron had vast armies probably outside the Gate as well as in. Plus they werent sure if Frodo was even alive or captured, Aragorn probably thought that if this was the end, they may as well go out with some dignity, head on and defiant, better to meet him before the gate than in dribs and drabs in the hills.

It is so refreshing when I get the chance to come and read, to see Mrs. Figg, tall and strong and putting things in order!

Mrs Figg wrote:yawn.

You are an absolute gift to this forum and I loved your shadowy people in your Nora story, it is riveting. Well done . And, gentlemen you need to treat this lady with great respect, she is in fact a princess in a foreign country and all her cousins are over six feet and well schooled in the martial arts......................and they know where you live.

"I'm not sure if I agree that it creates inconsistency. In PJ's Last Debate scene I got the feeling that the characters all thought of what they were doing as a suicide mission"- Eldo

From the film right after Gimli says "Why do we care?" Gandalf responds "Because ten thousand orcs now stand between Frodo and Mount Doom."
Aragorn goes on, "No, there is still hope for Frodo, he needs time and safe passage across the plains of Gorgoroth. We can give him that."
Gimli- "How?"
Aragorn -"Draw out Sauron's armies. Empty his lands. We gather our full strength and march on the Black Gate."
Eomer- "We cannot achieve victory through strength of arms."
Aragorn- "Not for ouselves but we can give Frodo a chance if we keep Saurons eye fixed upon us. Keeep him blind to all else that moves."

This is the same basic plan as in the book so having a suicide charge, destined to be brief and fatal is no more consitent with the words of film Aragorn than book.

leelee wrote:

Mrs Figg wrote:yawn.

You are an absolute gift to this forum and I loved your shadowy people in your Nora story, it is riveting. Well done . And, gentlemen you need to treat this lady with great respect, she is in fact a princess in a foreign country and all her cousins are over six feet and well schooled in the martial arts......................and they know where you live.

I have absolutely no desire to treat Mrs Figg with any respect at all, leelee. My goodness, next you'll have me being polite to ol' Petty.... I mean really, leelee...

{{{As to Mrs Figgs' cousins --- I hear they're in the Constabulary, leelee, like some of her other family members. All upstanding members of hobbit society --- nothing like Mrs Figg at all... }}}

Pettytyrant101 wrote:This is the same basic plan as in the book so having a suicide charge, destined to be brief and fatal is no more consitent with the words of film Aragorn than book.

Gimli also says that the plan has a "certainty of death" immediately after the exchange you quote. I don't know if this was intended to be sarcastic but it contributed to my interpretation. Clearly I could be mistaken but I got the sense from the film that PJ's characters didn't expect to survive. That was mainly based on subjective, non-verbal cues so I can't say for certain whether it was intended and I won't try to argue for that point any further.

He he! I think Orwell is right LeeLee, I am not very respectable at all, I mean, ladies having nasty things like opinionations, whatever next. Ill be expecting the men folk to iron my socks if Im not careful. Its a slippery slope.

It is true you do hold troublesome opinions- and you speak them. Out loud. Where people can hear them.

If I had a £ for everytime I should have buttoned it, well.. I would be on an tropical island shaped like PJ's nether regions in Dubai by now... or is that Saudi Arabia' never can remember..

I think we should have more discussion on PJ's nether region. If its what I think it is, that is.

Its the bit you are supposed to aim for when you kick him.

Somehow I knew you would say that as soon as I saw your name in this thread, Petty.

Here to help! And educate!

I wouldn't ever do such things! Though some things I would do.

I'm having bad 'imaginings' just now. I'm not sure I would want to be on an island like that...

I suppose it shouldn't surprise that PJ has eager groupies.

Why? Too hot? Natural disasters...though I suppose that wouldn't apply to you and PJ...
Oh, my mind does scare me so!

Orwell wrote:

leelee wrote:

Mrs Figg wrote:yawn.

You are an absolute gift to this forum and I loved your shadowy people in your Nora story, it is riveting. Well done . And, gentlemen you need to treat this lady with great respect, she is in fact a princess in a foreign country and all her cousins are over six feet and well schooled in the martial arts......................and they know where you live.

I have absolutely no desire to treat Mrs Figg with any respect at all, leelee. My goodness, next you'll have me being polite to ol' Petty.... I mean really, leelee...

{{{As to Mrs Figgs' cousins --- I hear they're in the Constabulary, leelee, like some of her other family members. All upstanding members of hobbit society --- nothing like Mrs Figg at all... }}}

Now now Orwell, you are very fractious at the moment. Come with me to the kitchen sink. I shall take a nice clean fragrant smelling face cloth, dip it in warm clear water and add a bit of soap. I shall wash your dear face from all the muck lingering there from supper, and wash out your mouth from all the muck lingering in there from , well "I don't know where from (NO DONT TELL ME) and give you a nice cup of tea and a butterscotch scone I made myself with lovely Devonshire cream on top. And then i will explain patiently to you why Princess Mrs. Figg is the superior person she is,..................and always will be.

Why? Too hot? Natural disasters..- Ally

An eruption in the region of the isle of PJ's Nether Regions is not to be contemplated! Ever!! And should be impossible if I kick hard enough!

Now that IS something I would pay good money to witness LeeLee. But I think all boys are a bit fractious now and again.

Why must you suggest butttercotch and cream just now? Are you trying to torture me, leelee?

As to Mrs Figg, of course she's superior. It's why I intend to divorce my Missus and take an eagle to Tuscany. I'm taking a class in "Advanced Wooing of Superior Ladies."

{{{Mrs Figg is also the reason I am dieting. I mean, you wouldnt want an old, fast, lazy middleaged sleazebag sweeping her off her feet would you, leelee? Surely she deserves a better sleazebag than that! }}}

Mrs Figg wrote: Now that IS something I would pay good money to witness LeeLee. But I think all boys are a bit fractious now and again.

Oh Hi, Mrs Figg...