Tolkien in General

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Post by chris63 Fri Jun 08, 2012 1:08 am

http://greyhavensgroup.wordpress.com/2012/06/07/tolkien-shoots-a-curious-bow/
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Post by Pettytyrant101 Fri Jun 08, 2012 1:13 am

An intresting propostion and not one that seems hugely unlikely to me. Which specific non european legends of creation from song he may have drawn on I would be more hesitant to guess but the notion he drew from one or more such sources for inspiration does not seem beyond the realms of possibility.

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Post by chris63 Wed Jun 13, 2012 4:25 am

Tolkiens only car.

http://www.omg-facts.com/History/J-R-R-Tolkien-used-the-only-car-he-ever/51878
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Post by Norc Wed Jun 13, 2012 7:40 am

the whole text deserves to be here:

J.R.R Tolkien used the only car he ever owned to accelerate dangerously down the street screaming “Charge ‘em and they scatter!”

On top of other little things, J.R.R Tolkien was famous for his extreme dislike of cars. However he did purchase a Morris Cowley in 1932 and nicknamed it “Jo” after the first two letters on its registration.

On a simple ride to visit his sister, he put poor “Jo” through quite a bit; she sustained two punctures and knocked down part of a wall. Some months later, he charged down a busy street on Oxford in order to get to the side street. He ignored all other vehicles and screamed “Charge ‘em and they Scatter”- and his prediction was pretty much correct.

After some time however, he saw what the internal combustion engine and new roads were doing the landscape, and never took hold of the wheel again. I’m assuming that they didn’t have driving tests back them, or the instructor would have definitely said “YOU SHALL NOT PASS!”
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Post by Mrs Figg Wed Jun 13, 2012 11:22 am

lol! that hilarious Norc. He should have ridden a grey/white horse instead.
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Post by Orwell Wed Jun 13, 2012 11:30 am

I think driving was all self-taught back then. Shame it's not now actually.

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Post by Elthir Wed Jun 13, 2012 6:10 pm

Mrs Figg wrote: He should have ridden a grey/white horse instead.

I beg you tease not my mind's eye with vague horse terms. If you would pick a colour rather -- your choices are: 'Shadowfax-grey' or 'Rohald-white'...

... keeping in mind that white might require more frequent cleaning.
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Post by Mrs Figg Wed Jun 13, 2012 6:38 pm

um Shadowfax grey then. Very Happy
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Post by chris63 Sat Jun 16, 2012 5:33 am

Tolkien and the great war.

http://middle-earth.xenite.org/2012/06/15/an-interview-with-john-garth/
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Post by Pettytyrant101 Sat Jun 16, 2012 3:36 pm

Fascinating stuff Chris- thanks for the link.
And if true that Tolkien saw Faramir as a sort of idolised version of himself, the scholar who has to put down the pen and take up the sword- then that only makes what PJ did to the character all the more insulting. Mad

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Post by RA Sat Jun 16, 2012 5:20 pm

That's what makes Faramir such an appealing character - his humility. He is the common man who fights to protect, not to kill. For memory, not for glory. For preserving, not for bloodshed.
He's much like a soldier who's been drafted in WWI and must fight to protect his family. Tolkien would be very familiar with that.
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Post by chris63 Wed Jul 04, 2012 2:45 am

http://brandonyoung.mymiddleearth.com/2012/07/03/tolkien-dante-st-thomas-aquinas-hierarchy-and-aesthetic-arrest-part-ii/


First, remember Tolkien’s famous quote from his Foreward: “The prime motive was the desire of a tale-teller to try his hand at a really long story that would hold the attention of readers, amuse them, delight them, and at times maybe excite them or deeply move them.” (Foreward, 2nd Edition, 1966)


Last edited by chris63 on Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:08 am; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Eldorion Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:04 am

St. Thomas Aquinas was the Doctor Angelicas (Angelic Doctor) one of the 33 Doctors of the Church, and the greatest philosopher of all time. He is known for his great summation of all philosophy in his great Summa Theologica which only God stopped him from dictating to scribe after scribe. When Jesus appeared to St. Thomas and asked him “You have written well of me Thomas, what will you have as your reward?” Thomas humbly replied “Only you Lord.”After this beatific vision Aquinas had, he called his massive three-part masterpiece and all his work “…straw compared to what I have seen.”

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Post by Norc Sat Jul 07, 2012 4:33 pm

WATSON!
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Post by Pettytyrant101 Tue Jul 10, 2012 3:49 pm

I was flicking through UT and came across a passage I had completely forgotten about.
Much is often made of Eowyn being a sort of feminist icon, others argue the ending of her story undermines that- but for a truelly female persepctive turn to the section 'Aldarion and Erendis' in UT.
In it there is a passage of the 'remarkable' teachings of Erendis to her daughter, Ancalime, on the subject of men and Numenor.
It makes for interesting reading and I can't offhand think of another example like it in Tolkiens writings:

'Men in Numenor are half-elves,' said Erendis, 'especially the high men; they are neither the one or the other. The long life that they were granted deceives them, and they dally in the world, children in mind, until age finds them- and then many forsake play out of doors for play in their houses. They turn their play into great matters and great matters into play.....and women to them are but fires on the hearth- for others to tend, until they are tired of play in the evening.
All things were made for their serivce: hills are for quarries, rivers to furnish water or to turn wheels, trees for boards, women for their body's need, or if fair to adorn table and hearth; and children to be teased when nothing else is to do- but they would as soon play with their hounds' whelps.......thus it is and we cannot alter it. For men fashioned Numenor: men, those heroes of old that they sing of- of their women we hear less, save that they wept when their men were slain.
Numenor was to be a rest after war. But if they weary of rest and the plays of peace, soon they will go back to their great play, manslaying and war.
Thus it is; and we are set among them. But we need not assent. If we love Numenor also, let us enjoy it before they ruin it.
We also are daughters of the great, and we have wills and courage of our own.
Therefore do not bend, Ancalime. Once bend a little, and they will bend you further until you are bowed down. Sink your roots into the rock, and face the wind, though it blow away your leaves.'

Thats certainly a different picture of the men of Numenor than the usual one!

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Post by Mrs Figg Tue Jul 10, 2012 4:01 pm

That passage explains Eowyns plight very well I think. She had refused to bend and all the blossom had withered on the tree, or become petrified. Then she met Aragorn and she knew he was different to any man she had met before, unfortunately he was taken.
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Post by Eldorion Tue Jul 10, 2012 4:26 pm

I'm not sure that the ending of Aldarion and Erendis really plays out in feminist fashion though. Doesn't Aldarion take his daughter away from Erendis and she eventually realizes that she had been an asshole, and dies alone (by implication from suicide)? I don't think Tolkien was really endorsing her viewpoint, though it's still interesting that he would include it at all.
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Post by Pettytyrant101 Tue Jul 10, 2012 5:24 pm

That's true Eldo, but thats the fate of the daughter- there is no indication, I dont think, that her mother ever changed her view.
And I doubt Tolkien was meaning she was just a crazy ranting old woman either, rather that she was voicing, albeit bitterly, genuine grievences the woman of Numenor could lay at their males feet.

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Post by Mrs Figg Tue Jul 10, 2012 5:28 pm

or that poor Lydia could place at yours. Mad
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Post by Pettytyrant101 Tue Jul 10, 2012 5:42 pm

Hey! I think I'm falling for Lydia Embarassed which is worrying given she is a computer game character- but look how lovely she is! I thnk thats why I tease her so much! Very Happy

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Post by Mrs Figg Tue Jul 10, 2012 6:45 pm

she looks like a nut cruncher to me. pale
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Post by Pettytyrant101 Tue Jul 10, 2012 6:48 pm

Well I like a bit of crabbit in my womenfolk. A bit of fight. More passion and violence they have more lively in the sack-well known Scotshobbit fact that. bounce (Not sure it applies to fictional computer game characters mind you).

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Post by Mrs Figg Tue Jul 10, 2012 6:55 pm

:facepalm:
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Post by Eldorion Tue Jul 10, 2012 8:57 pm

Pettytyrant101 wrote:That's true Eldo, but thats the fate of the daughter- there is no indication, I dont think, that her mother ever changed her view.
And I doubt Tolkien was meaning she was just a crazy ranting old woman either, rather that she was voicing, albeit bitterly, genuine grievences the woman of Numenor could lay at their males feet.

True, he does go out of his way to get the reader to sympathize with Erendis' plight. I think he also shows how she was treated unfairly by the King and other men in positions of power, which is notable as a somewhat feminist message in a work that is not exactly brimming with social commentary. However, she still meets and unfortunate and uncertain end, in part because of her pride and stubborn refusal to change her mind. Although Aldarion, despite becoming King, doesn't fare that well either.

Either way, it's a story that deserves more attention. Unfinished Tales and THoME has some truly great stuff, a lot of it very different from Tolkien's most famous works.
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Post by Ally Tue Jul 10, 2012 10:23 pm

I fell in love with Sven so didn't deliver his message to his crush!!



My real life plan is to kidnap Ryan Gosling and lock him in my bedroom

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