Battle of the Five Armies - Extended Edition

Mrs Figg wrote:The look of them annoyed me from the minute I saw them.

For real. I was appalled when they were first unveiling those designs. By the end of AUJ they weren't quite so distracting but they still took away from certain scenes for me. One of the major video reviews of The Hobbit that got shared here made the point that there seemed to be a lot of attempts by the cast and crew to give the dwarves distinct characters but that for time reasons, the only bits that really made it into the finished films were the wacky costumes (to distinguish them each visually) and one or two traits each that they couldn't change even when it made sense to (so we get Nori (or whoever) fighting orcs with a slingshot because "the one with the slingshot" is like half his character).

Mrs Figg wrote:If I ever did a fan edit all that would be left would be enough for a trailer. it would have all the Balin bits, butterflies, and sparks coming up a chimbley. fin.

The butterflies and the sparks from the chimney are probably my two favorite shots from the whole trilogy, so good choice there IMO.

halfwise wrote:And they cut out the worst part in Elrond's house - it could have been twice as bad.  Yeah, Balin was the only dwarf that seemed right.  Half the credit goes to the actor for that one.

Agreed about Ken Stott doing a great job. I think a couple of the other dwarf actors deserve credit when they had a chance to act. Bifur, even though he looked like Genghis Khan cosplaying as Pippi Longstocking, was great in the scene in the cave with Bilbo in AUJ.

bungobaggins wrote:I always remember Dori because Bilbo is dangling from his legs during the eagle rescue. Too bad I just wanted to punch movie Dori in the face the whole time.

Good point.

Anyone got got this yet ? came out here in Aus yesterday. My day off tomorrow might get it and watch the 10hrs of extras.
Couple bottles of wine chips crisps and dip. Sounds like a plan.

Watched the EE proper during the theatrical (re-)release and have seen a bunch of clips from the bonus features online since the digital release, although nowhere near the full 10 hours. I don't plan on watching the film again anytime soon though so I'm not buying it now.

Any new clips other than the ones we've already discussed (acorn scene, and extended funeral) ?

If I saw the EE in the bargain bucket in Poundland and it had a 99p discount I still would begrudge paying the 1p.

I still haven't seen Three... don't even feel an urge... you weaklings, you!

I did say i was going to watch the extras

davidjoneshoward wrote:Any new clips other than the ones we've already discussed (acorn scene, and extended funeral) ?

I literally just saw this one posted on another forum. Really candid and honestly kinda depressing look at the chaos of the initial period of principal photography and PJ's mental state during that. I've heard people talk about the lack of prep time after GDT left but it's interesting to hear from e.g. John Howe that they basically started over completely. Jed Brophy's point about going straight from Tintin to The Hobbit is an interesting one too. But mainly I just feel bad for PJ. He looks so dead inside in a lot of those shots.

You can feel a tinge of pity for the guy, I know I did & Ive called him all sorts ! Its a shame, in glorious hindsight, that everyone couldnt say they NEEDED time to plan out a strategy. It might have been a better film for it. But, I guess time is money & everyone has other commitments, shame though. He did look like a lost puppy at the end didnt he. I admire some one much more if they are honest ! why be something your not ? Honesty ranks high up on the list for me.

I do feel sympathy and it must have been unbelievable stressful, but my question is, did it need to be? why couldn't he just have refused to do 3 films, refused to be rushed and unprepared, surely he had that much control over the process?, after all the studios want a good product and if their major director is half dead with fatigue its not good for anyone. He must have known beforehand of the gigantic colossal task in front of him, its unbelievable to even start the process without planning. I think PJ is probably not a natural planner, he is creative and needs time and space to flourish, these films would have been a superhuman task for someone way better organised and disciplined. poor Peter, this video is too late to help him, but at least I can see the stress he was under. But there is only so much sympathy you can have for all the cash he was getting and its funny they release this video now, we didn't see all this during those super enthusiastic vlogs did we.

One thing that this video definitely confirms is that Peter Jackson has not earned the George Lucas status yet. I they had, I think they would have basically said yes to every one of Peter Jackson's requests, and it seems like that wasn't the case.

If the star wars prequels were in the control of the studios more than they already were, we would have gotten a trilogy that would have probably been made closer together. I think all the marketing aspects of it were implemented by Lucas (whereas Jackson stated that he hates those types of movies). Frankly though, studio or no studio, I'm sure how much of a difference that would have made saying the prequels were utter shit anyways but you get my point.

Viggo Mortensen wrote:They didn’t have an inkling until they showed 20 minutes in Cannes, in May of 2001. They were in a lot of trouble, and Peter had spent a lot. Officially, he could say that he was finished in December 2000 – he’d shot all three films in the trilogy – but really the second and third ones were a mess. It was very sloppy – it just wasn’t done at all. It needed massive reshoots, which we did, year after year. But he would have never been given the extra money to do those if the first one hadn’t been a huge success. The second and third ones would have been straight to video.

I am actually quite curious how this would turned out, if it went to video. Would it have given it the intimate feel that fellowship had? Did the extra money go to waste, or make it feel bloated; or was it in truth needed to make it stronger?

TTT and ROTK would have been disasters if they'd been released straight-to-video. Not just for the lack of reshoots, but the lack of time and money to complete all the effects shots. And you can bet that there would have been no extended cuts.

davidjoneshoward wrote:If the star wars prequels were in the control of the studios more than they already were

Not sure what you mean by "more than they already were". Every Star Wars movie post-ANH was funded by Lucasfilm, not by Fox. Lucas spent years building a whole infrastructure around him so that he could operate independently from the studio system that he felt had screwed him over early in his career. Regardless of what you think of the SW prequels, they were very much products of George Lucas' vision.

Eldorion wrote:Not sure what you mean by "more than they already were".  Every Star Wars movie post-ANH was funded by Lucasfilm, not by Fox.  Lucas spent years building a whole infrastructure around him so that he could operate independently from the studio system that he felt had screwed him over early in his career.  Regardless of what you think of the SW prequels, they were very much products of George Lucas' vision.

Yes, that's exactly what I meant to say. I knew that George Lucas had complete creative control for all the films. What I meant though, is if the studios had any input whatsoever, I think they would have added more villains, or make the trilogy be made closer together. I noted, however, that Lucas's vision would have been as shitty as the way the studios would have made the movies if it were up to them

After last week, and now getting ready for this week's D&D games that I've been DMing, I have the tiniest slightest little understanding of what that must be like to go through. Having to create something that other people are going to be involved with creatively, but that you have to lay the groundwork for and sort of over-see everything that goes on, can be very difficult emotionally and very tiring. 

Of course, running a D&D game and directing a film are almost entirely different, but I felt a bit of sympathy for old PJ and Co. 

I wonder if that's the point of this video? Is it taken from the Making Of? It seems almost like a Hobbit apologist's take on where things went wrong and why it's not PJ's fault!

Mrs Figg wrote:I do feel sympathy and it must have been unbelievable stressful, but my question is, did it need to be? why couldn't he just have refused to do 3 films, refused to be rushed and unprepared, surely he had that much control over the process?, after all the studios want a good product and if their major director is half dead with fatigue its not good for anyone. He must have known beforehand of the gigantic colossal task in front of him, its unbelievable to even start the process without planning. I think PJ is probably not a natural planner, he is creative and needs time and space to flourish, these films would have been a superhuman task for someone way better organised and disciplined. poor Peter, this video is too late to help him, but at least I can see the stress he was under. But there is only so much sympathy you can have for all the cash he was getting and its funny they release this video now, we didn't see all this during those super enthusiastic vlogs did we.

Jackson refusing probably wasn't an option, the films had already been delayed by legal issues and the studios and NZ government had spent many millions on pre-production with a director, most of which had to be thrown away when he quit at short notice, time and money was pouring away for them form a business point of view, and they had to act quickly whilst they still retained an option on the source material and an interested audience (you only have to look at the decreasing 'domestic' box office figures for TH trilogy to realise it wasn't going to have the cultural impact of LOTR, no matter how quickly they were released).

Jackson may have kept a distance from the crew whilst GDT was prepping his version, but as an executive producer and co-writer on the project very familiar with the source material and infrastructure of the NZ film industry he was really the only option to take over, he may have essentially made up the films as he went along, but at least had prior experience with LOTR and knew had to handle the pressure and timescales of such a massive production, we can moan all we like about the finished result, but the studios weren't going to walk away from the project, and Jackson wasn't going to bow out when he knew he owed it to the fans and crew of LOTR so much of his success as a filmmaker, there was simply too much pressure, money and expectation riding on these films, I seriously doubt any other filmmaker would want (or be be allowed by the studios) to take over at such short notice and whilst the finished films may have been disappointing overall as follow ups to LOTR, and infuriating as adaptations at times, they were arguably the best we could have expected under such conditions (that's not to say Jackson's filmaking methods and apparent indifference to the source material weren't contributing factors to this trilogies's flaws and failures), and retain more artistry and passion than the majority of hollywood blockbusters.


I do have some sympathy for Jackson, but this video doesn't really reveal anything we didn't already know or could had made an educated guess at, and it doesn't really change my feelings on the final finished films...as an artist and businessman working to a tight deadline with hardly any prep, moreover one responsible for guiding a crew of thousands under enormous pressure and expectations from all corners of the industry and fanbase, as a filmaker making the films he wanted, I can't fault Jackson for doing what he felt was right under the circumstances...and I certainly wouldn't want the job under those conditions.

personally speaking I got the impression that these films were karmic poison from the outset, they were dogged by nasty events and silly though it sounds I think they were fighting a losing battle. there were earthquakes, illness, dead animals, law suits, angry native peoples, sacred mountains and all manner of weird shit floating around. well that's my take on it anyway.

He could have made his life a lot easier by just following the book...

(I suppose the tsunami towards an action epic was irresistible at this point, though)

Quite right Halfy. He pressed for three films having made such a meandering arse of the first two and run outof time.

Had he simply gone- we don't have the prep time, we have to do the book version- two snappy, quick paced children's tales but with the look and physical reality of FotR.

Problems solved- the script damn near writes itself if you just do the book and you save yourself an entire films worth of work in one fell swoop and countless complicated months shooting over the top actions scenes that require a ton of equally complicated cgi.

And that most people end up hating !

I'd have rather seen Jackson decide to go small with The Hobbit too, but the fact is that the three films together did earn $2.2 billion more than they cost, and they did get average-ish ratings. That's not going to hurt PJ's reputation in the film industry too badly.

Pettytyrant101 wrote:

Had he simply gone- we don't have the prep time, we have to do the book version- two snappy, quick paced children's tales but with the look and physical reality of FotR.

.

Was that really a realistic option? The Hobbit may have been a immensely popular children's book, but after the darker, adult orientated LOTR had proven a huge success, the studios were never going to be totally happy with a simpler smaller story aimed at a smaller range of people, I know of several grown adults who had never read the book, who were turned off by the more child friendly tone of AUJ and didn't bother seeing the later films, many people like it or not were probably expecting something like LOTR in tone, Jackson was kinda screwed by the circumstances into making a hodgepodge of different tones.

The physical reality-more practical effects and location shooting wasn't going to happen either I don't think with the short prep time and bulky 3d cameras to lug around...