Re: Things that are making you crabbit!

by Eldorion Sun Mar 11, 2012 6:17 pm

To be perfectly honest I can kind of understand where he's coming from. Engaging in truly serious discussion of Tolkien's works requires approaching them as a student or scholar moreso than as a fan. That can be enjoyable in its own way, but it removes a lot of the 'fun' and many people don't like doing that. Based on some of the comments in that thread I get the sense that that's the case there. I really can't criticize anyone for wanting to stick to the lighter material; I've been drifting in that direction for a while now. However, I think it's important to admit when you're out of your depth instead of babbling like an idiot and trying to invent rules about what is and isn't admissible so you can be always right. I went through that process of realizing that myself, but I was only 14 at the time and still new to forums.

by **Amarië** Sun Mar 11, 2012 6:56 pm

Eldorion wrote:To be perfectly honest I can kind of understand where he's coming from. Engaging in truly serious discussion of Tolkien's works requires approaching them as a student or scholar moreso than as a fan. That can be enjoyable in its own way, but it removes a lot of the 'fun' and many people don't like doing that. Based on some of the comments in that thread I get the sense that that's the case there. I really can't criticize anyone for wanting to stick to the lighter material; I've been drifting in that direction for a while now. However, I think it's important to admit when you're out of your depth instead of babbling like an idiot and trying to invent rules about what is and isn't admissible so you can be always right. I went through that process of realizing that myself, but I was only 14 at the time and still new to forums.

'Removes the fun?' That is what MAKES it fun! Very Happy

Bree was made for the light weights and movie fans. I think you meant to post on the Dark Planet. Nod

You can change your username you know, no-one wouldn't know it was you. Things that are making you crabbit! - Page 10 _plystre

by Norc Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:15 pm

so in other words, don't babble about things you don't know anything about? and that it is more fun with the lighter stuff? or that those who aren't so read up on Tolkien shouldn't discuss?

As for me, I am no lore master, but I find it quite interesting when you guys have serious debates about e.g shadowfax's colour, so, I don't know, isn't it fun to have an outsider step in and look at it from a different angle, although the person may be completely wrong?

by **Amarië** Sun Mar 11, 2012 8:21 pm

Norc wrote:(...) isn't it fun to have an outsider step in and look at it from a different angle, although the person may be completely wrong?

I think that is gold! I love it when someone post a question or a thought which makes you say: You know, I have never thought about it like that before! Smile

(Not that I am much of a lore master... I did pick up a little bit back in the days, then Mother Nature in her wisdom rebooted my brain into Mommy Mode, deleting all previous information.)

But sometimes people aren't interesting in discussing or conversation, they only want to hear: "Oh yes you are so very right in every way! Halleluja! My oh my, how clever you are!" (You know, a bit like Orwell. Wink

) And that can get a bit frustrating.

by Mrs Figg Sun Mar 11, 2012 8:25 pm

I agree with you Norc, as a 'light weight' from Bree, I am not afraid of voicing an opinion on threads even though I havent studied the subject of them for a PhD. The forums are for everyone from the casual movie fan to the scholar, and entering into these discussions you can learn stuff as well as have fun. What I have learnt is that people should be allowed to have their own 'take' on Tolkien, if they want to have an opinion on for example a certain character, they should be allowed to have it, its when that opinion is denied to them and ridiculed that problems arise. People can get very 'precious' about what is canon and what isnt which is ironic when you think about it. I am talking about the books here not the films.

by Pettytyrant101 Sun Mar 11, 2012 8:31 pm

As I said over on Bree I avoid the whole canon thing by taking the differing versions as varying legends that have survived to our times, and naturally, like all legends and myths, there are various interpretations. Solves any problems for me thinking of them that way and it fits with how Tolkien liked to view it.

by Norc Sun Mar 11, 2012 8:51 pm

i think that a key-part in entering a forum (or any kind of discussion) is to know what ur opinion is, but also have an open mind. Smile

for instant, I've learned, well not a lot, but some new things about Tolkien's work here. I also think it is cool that if I have a question about e.g who Glorfindel was, I can be quite certain someone here will know. Wink

Amarië: "But sometimes people aren't interesting in discussing or conversation, they only want to hear: "Oh yes you are so very right in every way! Halleluja! My oh my, how clever you are!" (You know, a bit like Orwell. ) And that can get a bit frustrating."

yes, that can be quite frustrating.

by **Orwell** Sun Mar 11, 2012 9:56 pm

I hope you guys aren't accusing Petty of having an open mind! Shocked

We Tolkien Purists don't hold with that kind of lily-livered namby-pamby thinking! Banghead

by Norc Sun Mar 11, 2012 9:59 pm

I've noticed that (it was more of a hint Rolling Eyes

)

by **Orwell** Sun Mar 11, 2012 10:04 pm

So long as we understand each other, Norc. Suspect

by Pettytyrant101 Sun Mar 11, 2012 10:13 pm

I hope you guys aren't accusing Petty of having an open mind!- Orwell

They better not be! Evil or Very Mad

by **Amarië** Sun Mar 11, 2012 10:30 pm

(I didn't meant that all Breelanders were lightweights though, Norc and Figg should be rolling their eyes slightly and say 'yeah, those people, haven't we all met one or two...'. Not identifying with them... )

by **Orwell** Sun Mar 11, 2012 10:34 pm

I suspect that Breelanders can be flighty at times... I mean, they sometimes show all the telltale signs of Tolkien Liberalism.... oooh! I've said it now --- what a filthy phrase that is - "Tolkien Liberalism' --- Ooh I said it again... pleeeease... somebody stop me.... Suspect

by **Amarië** Sun Mar 11, 2012 10:37 pm

Orwell wrote:I suspect that Breelanders can be flighty at times... I mean, they sometimes show all the telltale signs of Tolkien Liberalism.... oooh! I've said it now --- what a filthy phrase that is - "Tolkien Liberalism' --- Ooh I said it again... pleeeease... somebody stop me....

Things that are making you crabbit! - Page 10 Foranbarna2

by **Orwell** Sun Mar 11, 2012 10:39 pm

Amarië wrote:

Please add to Emoticons! lol!

by Mrs Figg Sun Mar 11, 2012 10:54 pm

yeah that emoticon is cool.
I am a lightweight though and dont have a problem with it, I havent studied Tolkien at all, never read affraid

the Silmarilion or UT

doesnt stop me having an opinion though.

by **Orwell** Sun Mar 11, 2012 11:24 pm

A guy once told me years ago that the less he knew about a subject the stronger his opinions tended to be on it. It's a philosophy I've gladly adopted. It's less time consuming to debate people if you don't bother too much about actual research. At least, it works for me. Very Happy

{{{{{Eldo and Petty obviously research things more deeply than I do, but 'knowledge' doesn't translate as 'wisdom' with them; them being such morons and all. But please keep that between you and I, Mrs Figg - as I am quite fond of those dolts and would not wish to hurt their feelings! Even moronic dolts have feelings, you know. Surprised

}}}}}

by Mrs Figg Sun Mar 11, 2012 11:32 pm

you know I can read your encription dont you? I think the spell is wearing off, either that or the peppermint is minting it off.

by **Orwell** Sun Mar 11, 2012 11:44 pm

{{{Oh sweetums! That's EXACTLY how encryption spells work. If they are addressed to you - or clearly by the nature and thrust of their text MEANT for you - then no one else can read them but YOU! While they are spells they still operate on a quite scientific basis. Now Eldo and Petty and GB have admin powers to READ encryption spells not intened for them --- but that's plain rude, unfair and, frankly, soooooo boring of them it's not funny! Rolling Eyes

And NOT being thought 'funny' in Forumshire is the worst insult one can lay! Banghead

}}}

by Eldorion Sun Mar 11, 2012 11:44 pm

Norc wrote:so in other words, don't babble about things you don't know anything about? and that it is more fun with the lighter stuff? or that those who aren't so read up on Tolkien shouldn't discuss?

That's not what I said. Wink

I'm annoyed with Stuart largely because I think he's a prick in general, but the "babbling on" comment was in regards to his behavior after other people provided further information. I never said that people who haven't made serious study of Tolkien shouldn't participate in discussions or can't have opinion. However, as with pretty much any topic, I think it's good to know the limits of ones knowledge. There are plenty of things I like to talk about that I realize I'm not an expert on and I'm willing to admit when I've exhausted what I know. Stuart, on the other hand, has now filled two threads with his whining about how unfair it is that he'd never read Tolkien's Glorfindel essays before so therefore they shouldn't count.

by Pettytyrant101 Sun Mar 11, 2012 11:48 pm

I just want to say for the record Orwell I would never use my mod powers to read an encrypted message not meant for me..........oh dear. pale

by halfwise Mon Mar 12, 2012 12:27 am

DO pick up unfinished tales, ms Figg! The way to read it is to flip through the table of contents and go "Ooo! There's a whole chapter just talking about wizards!" "Ooo! I can read how Gandalf convinced Thorin to take along a hobbit!" "Oooo....."

It just goes on and on. Eventually you can read the stuff near the front, but the stuff at the back is the most fun. I think you'll come to treasure it as much as the Hobbit or LoTR. Eventually you'll start reading the footnotes, and then your fate is sealed.

by **Orwell** Mon Mar 12, 2012 1:53 am

Pettytyrant101 wrote:I just want to say for the record Orwell I would never use my mod powers to read an encrypted message not meant for me..........oh dear.

I hope you've learnt a valuable lesson here, Petty! Suspect

by Mrs Figg Mon Mar 12, 2012 4:48 pm

well Halfwise when I said I hadnt read the Sillymillyron, I DID try, and I read some of it, the juicy bits, but I havent read all of it as I found it a bit turgid and there were a bewildering amount of folk wandering about. As to UT you are right I will have to get a copy and delve like the dwarves until I find Mithril or something scarier and darker like the underside of Petty's kilt. Shocked

Orwell I didnt know about the encription thingy, does that mean I am supposed to be able to read it? its very confusing. Mad

by Pettytyrant101 Mon Mar 12, 2012 5:35 pm

Mrs Figg encrytpions work by magical wilful ignorance! If its in {{{}}}} brackets a message is 'encrypted'- it can only be read (therefore responded to) by the person it is addressed to {{{Hello Mrs Figg- that Odo is a buffoon and no mistake!!}}}- the number of brackets reflects how strongly encrypted a message is, in the above one you can read it and respond as its addressed to you, but Odo (to um pick a name at random) cannot. It adds a whole arena of mischevious fun to proceedings.
Make any more sense yet?