Re: All New Who

by Pettytyrant101 Tue Mar 01, 2022 8:54 am

{{ More Who news- this from the Sun newspaper.
They are claiming the 60th will be a series of episodes (if so thats one prediction Ive got right at least!) and that each episode will star a former Doctor. Which Doctors is not so clear, the Sun are saying Tennant, Smith and possibly Capaldi will all return. I doubt Eccleston would given its same production team screwed him over the first time. And there is also talk of classic Doctors making an appearance- the most likely there would be 5, 6, 7 and 8. Tom is getting on but could be still up for an appearance. We might also see some classic companions like Ace if we do get any classic Doctors- though how they will do the classic Doctors, try to de-age them with cgi, or juts go for some excuse for their physical appearance as they did in the 5 meets 10 Re Nose Day short.

If the Sun are right and the 60th will be a series of episodes each with a different previous Doctor then that would explain why whose been cast as 14 still has not been announced so near to shooting starting in April.}}

by **Amarië** Tue Mar 01, 2022 10:06 am

Wow, that's back to the roots for real! Sounds like a nostalgia bonanza for old fans and a history lesson for the 13 fans. Which is what we need, I suppose?

by Pettytyrant101 Tue Mar 01, 2022 11:34 am

{{ I can see some sense to it- have a series thats episodes each of former Doctors to bolster folks interest back up with previous more popular versions, then at the end of it bring in the new Doctor, making them seem more like a successor to previous than to Chibnall era. One assumes Jodies version wont be in these episodes as she has already officially left, unless its a small part she could have filmed before wrapping up her own BBC Centenary special.
Does raise the issue of if 13 will even get an onscreen regeneration. }}

by Bluebottle Sat Mar 05, 2022 9:29 am

Maybe they'll reuse Shada again Razz

by Pettytyrant101 Sat Apr 16, 2022 9:25 pm

{{ Excellent interview from Council of Geeks with BF co-founder Jason Haigh-Ellery. The section on diversity and representation is particularly worth a nosey. And first time Ive seen her do an interview, does a good job, by being non confrontational or seeking sensation she actually gets some proper discussion going, and most importantly willing to listen. }}

by Pettytyrant101 Sun Apr 17, 2022 12:19 am

{{ Probably one of the most personal and important fan vids Ive ever seen. From Margarita Life whose edits Ive featured here before for their ability to tap the themes of Who.
She is Ukrainian. And still there as the war rages.

I think in its own way, as well as allowing her a way to have something to say, it sums up why I have always loved Who, its applicability. It has something to say, almost always, that relates and resonates with life experience. Like life its stupid, silly but at turns profound and truthful too. And no vid Ive seen encompasses this as much as Who, edited from Ukraine at this moment in Time. And at such moments is when you need the Doctor most and Im glad she has at least that still for comfort and above all for the shows eternal belief in hope.}}

by azriel Sun Apr 17, 2022 4:28 pm

Dr Who was always about hope, that was my interpretation of it. Even as a child and hiding behind the cushions because the Daleks scared me shitless I still felt hope.

by Mrs Figg Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:00 pm

Spoiler:

by Forest Shepherd Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:25 pm

What now?

by Pettytyrant101 Mon Apr 18, 2022 6:10 pm

Spoiler:

by Mrs Figg Mon Apr 18, 2022 8:54 pm

Spoiler:

by Pettytyrant101 Tue Apr 19, 2022 11:44 am

{{ The Doctor whilst confessing her love for Yaz and calling Yaz the best person she has ever met, and then immediately adding, "and that includes my wife," did for me. Seriously?
River got many series of development, and story and meaningful interactions with 3 different Doctors. A character loved broadly speaking by fans, and by Alex Kingston, who is still playing River often alongside the classic Doctors in her BF series The Diary of River Song. A character of massive personal meaning to the Doctor. And love or hate River no one can deny she had plenty of personality and charisma about her. And Yaz is the bestest ever? Yaz the plank? Yaz the personality vacuum? The only companion ever to have less personality than the sonic screwdriver? (Ok maybe Ryan too)

I don't know if its Chibnall hubris, that his companion will be the most significant to the Doctor ever no matter what, along with the whole rewriting of the Doctors origins as non-Galifreyean it seems he has a desire to make it his own no matter what.
But as you say Figg is not in the slightest bit earned. Its not been there on screen to justify it. Its not been developed in any fashion. Its not like 10 and Rose that developed across 2 Doctors and spanned 3 series to tell, or 11/12/River which was an intrinsic part of those eras and the characters in them.

The tragedy isnt that Who did a same sex storyline, the tragedy is the first time it did it was so clumsily shoehorned in as fan service to a small but vocal section of fandom who wanted it to happen. Its ill served by doing so, its a subject that deserves far more care attention and love not this crude shoving of it into an already existing narrative. This isn't a topic or something supposedly so important to the characters that you can just insert it as a late rewrite like this into an existing story and expect to get away with it. }}

by Mrs Figg Tue Apr 19, 2022 3:15 pm

I think Chibnal is an appalling writer. This proves it. Just think of the minute development River, Rose, Donna and Martha got. Their relationships had a clear arc and development. People were invested in their friendships and were sad when they left. Yaz the Plank has had zero development, the 'romance' thing is a bit of an insult to our intelligence. Yaz is one of the most badly acted boring nondescript companions in Who history, apart from Ryan the Plank, and he was teeth achingly dull. The whole 'fam' thing was cringe. I have decided John Bishop is a Plank as well. Good riddance to the lot of them.

by Pettytyrant101 Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:15 pm

{{ AI was 76- another in the long line of this series's episodes to be below 80- I've lost count of how many now. }}

by malickfan Wed Apr 20, 2022 11:51 pm

Pettytyrant101 wrote:{{ AI was 76- another in the long line of this series's episodes to be below 80- I've lost count of how many now. }}

At least it's consistent...consistently average that is Sleep

by malickfan Thu Apr 21, 2022 12:15 am

Some interesting rumours were leaked on Gallifreybase recently, dunno if there's any truth to them though:

Rumours/possible spoilers:

...some of these don't sound too far fetched...though I rather doubt the one about Classic Doctors appearing in the centenary special (unless Ace and Tegan are in it as red herring-Ace returning in the special was actually rumoured months ago) there's already alot to cram into a single story!

by Pettytyrant101 Fri Apr 22, 2022 7:32 pm

{{ I dont think RTD would be coming back to do the same again,so it makes sense to me that they are going to quite drastically shake things up.
Other strong rumours that seem to have some backing is that the BBC cancelled the show- the original plan was for Jodies run to end ambiguously with her starting to regenerate but leaving it on a cliffhanger as screen fades to black- then it was going on hiatus again like in the 80's. It was only RTD and Bad Wolf stepping in that saved it.

I wouldnt be surprised if we still dont get a full onscreen regeneration for 13. She shot her final scenes last October and as far as we know there still hasnt been a new Doctor cast yet so they cant have shot a normal regen. They could shoot it later and add it in post- as they did Capaldi/Jodie but I get the feeling when it comes back with RTD it might be like with 9- there will just be a Doctor we havent seen before. }}

by Mrs Figg Sat Apr 23, 2022 6:07 pm

RTD needs to be really careful about casting the new Doctor. He was 100% spot on with Eccy and Tennant and if he goes for a 'diverse' actor it will really make me irritated, as will asking people who have no business in sci-fi like Juno Dawson to write stories for Who. I know he likes Olly Alexander, but I really hope he doesn't go down that route. I hope RTD has taken on the criticisms of the politically correct acting and stories, they don't work and nobody likes them.

by **Amarië** Fri Apr 29, 2022 11:05 pm

Finally got around to seeing the sea devil thing. Tardis underwater scene and the Chinese guy with the fancy clothes were the best of the episode. Rest was so bad it became entertaining! So, I think this is the most I have enjoyed a 13 episode?! scratch

by Pettytyrant101 Sat Apr 30, 2022 6:24 am

{{ Chibnal has been doing the interview rounds, and its not good. Basically all that stuff the BBC let leak out and not correct at the start- the 5 year plan, how Chibbers had it all planned out? Yeah none of that was true and in fact the opposite was, he was completely making it up as he went along.
The Fugitive Doctor wasnt in the Judoon script, she was a last minute idea Chibnal had. He doesnt know where she sits in the timeline but says she is in one of the many gaps- only there arent many gaps, in fact there is really only one possible gap and thats been 2 and 3 as its the only time we dont see the Doctor regenerate into their next incarnation. But then if thats the case why change it from the long established fan theory 2 worked for the CIA (not the US version but the Gallifrey secret service, the Celestial Intervention Agency) to the Division? But if she is after 2 why does she not know what a sonic screwdriver is? The device was introduced in 2's final story.
So the only real place she could be is before the 1st- but then why does she have a police box shaped TARDIS- the TARDIS only took on that shape and got stuck as it in the first episode of the show with the 1st Doctor. So she cant go there either.
So Chibnall basically doesnt know, she doesnt actually fit in anywhere and has decided to leave it at that it seems, saying its meant to be a mystery for fans to discuss! All we discuss is how badly cobbled together an idea it is and how badly thought it, how unplanned and how it doesnt work!

Likewise Thasmin was not planned for. It came purely from a section of the fandom- the two actresses got wind of it and started playing up some scenes, not written specifically for it, in a more suggestive manner- but it was not until two episodes from the final episode the writers decided to actually write deliberately for it. So no wonder it feels unsatisfying, not explored or set up properly and not well written.

The real big news is that had RTD not come along to take on the show the BBC were canning it, well putting it on hiatus again at least with an open ended finale and no regeneration. More incredibly the mess of the Sea Devils episode was supposed to be the final episode with 13 drowning underwater and us not seeing if she regens or not (presumably she would have actually sacrificed something herself for once and blew the place up instead of Chinese guy). But what a terrible, dull, broken episode to have given her for her final turn as the character!

The Timeless Child doesnt look like it will have further reveals or we will ever see all those stolen memories- according to Chibnal its meant to put the mystery back into the Doctor. How the Doctor being much older than we knew having lots of previous lives before 1 and being an unknown being from places unknown and not a Time lord at all- adds more mystery than what we had- a Doctor who was at least 2000 years old but might be far older (now thanks to Chibnall we know for sure they are- thats not more mystery thats confirming something and removing the mystery!) and who for reasons we have never found out decided to take his granddaughter, steal a TARDIS from a museum and go on the run from his own people- its been hinted of several possible ominous things for why but never confirmed, and mixed with it the idea there is more to the Doctor than anyone, even fellow Time Lords and possibly the Doctor themselves, knows. Why was that not already mysterious enough? We already never really knew who the Doctor actually was, or what they are truly capable of- note my description of the previously established cannon is full of words like 'possibly', 'hinted at', 'never confirmed'- that because for over 50 years other writers managed to drop hints whilst only building on the original mysterious around the Doctors past), this is the same only it stomps on a lot of what has come before or undermines the drama of it when seen through the Timeless Child filter. The Doctor being an unknown being who fell out a space portal is not abetter or more interesting mystery than the original. And more importantly it serves no purpose but to be an alternative mystery. So what was the point of swapping one perfectly good mystery with over 50 years of weight and speculation and theory behind it for another not so good one?

RTD was cleverer when he placed his changes inbetween the end of classic and the return of Who- the Time War changed fundamentals, got rid of the Time Lords, gave the Doctor PTSD, but it only changed the premise going forward. It didnt overwrite, contradict or undermine what had already happened in classic.
Similarly when Moffat undid the end of the Time War and saved Gallifrey he did it in such a fashion that it doesnt change how 9/10 viewed the war or their post war experiences as a result of it. It changes a fundamental again, but again it doesnt overwrite or undercut what has come before it.

Chibbers Timeless Child does, yeah you can argue it fits with Morbius and a couple of ambiguous lines of dialogue from the 7th Doctor era, but it contradicts and undermines and takes the drama out of far more thats come before. Its careless. And it seems as Chibbers had no plans or ideas for his Who beyond cast a woman and then just made stuff up n the fly (he's also admitted some episodes were 1st drafts- how does that even happen on show like Who?) the reason his era is so uneven, the characters so shallow and lacking in solid character traits week to week are because compared to his predecessors Chibbers wasn't really even trying.}}

by Pettytyrant101 Sat Apr 30, 2022 6:58 am

{{ Who does trans and doesnt make an utter pigs ear of it like it would with Chibnall! Written by Juno Dawson. who is a Guardian journalist of all things its called Doctor Who: Redacted. Its all the things the worst of Chibnall critics accuse his Who of being- political, social commentary and with a lot of representation.
Juno herself describes it as '“very gay, very trans”, and sitting “to the left” of the main show.' So its not pretending its not all the things Chibnall Who does so badly.

So why am I recommending this? It reminds me of RTD, its not up to his standards of character writing, but it leans in that direction. Its simply well written, a good story, with good characters. Who has always been mainly a bit left leaning, its often had something to say (during the McCoy era the showrunners openly spoke of how they wanted to use the show to undermine the Thatcher government) and it can do that, but only if it first remembers to tell a good story with good characters- the two main bits Chibnall forgot leaving only his clumsy messaging behind. This achieves the same aims far better. }}

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0c0wkjf

by Mrs Figg Sat Apr 30, 2022 5:45 pm

Pettytyrant101 wrote:{{ Who does trans and doesnt make an utter pigs ear of it like it would with Chibnall! Written by Juno Dawson. who is a Guardian journalist of all things its called Doctor Who: Redacted. Its all the things the worst of Chibnall critics accuse his Who of being- political, social commentary and with a lot of representation.
Juno herself describes it as '“very gay, very trans”, and sitting “to the left” of the main show.' So its not pretending its not all the things Chibnall Who does so badly.

So why am I recommending this? It reminds me of RTD, its not up to his standards of character writing, but it leans in that direction. Its simply well written, a good story, with good characters. Who has always been mainly a bit left leaning, its often had something to say (during the McCoy era the showrunners openly spoke of how they wanted to use the show to undermine the Thatcher government) and it can do that, but only if it first remembers to tell a good story with good characters- the two main bits Chibnall forgot leaving only his clumsy messaging behind. This achieves the same aims far better. }}

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0c0wkjf

please no. I have had it with gender ideology being shoehorned into Who. Its peak Guardian. I read the Guardian but they are obsessed with pushing this agenda.

by Pettytyrant101 Sat Apr 30, 2022 10:12 pm

{{ Thats the thing, its about three friends, one is straight, one is lesbian the other is trans, they all live in different parts of the UK, Glasgow, Sheffield and London and they do a blog cast together around the mystery of the Blue Box. So whilst its also about the social issues they dont actually feel too shoehorned or forced in as it all naturally arises out of the characters. And they are proper characters, RTD style not Chibbers 2D cardboard cutouts so it doesnt feel like their sexuality is the point of them, just an aspect of their characters.
I recommend it on its own merits. No one more fed up than me with Who being crudely used to shove social/political messages in, but when its done right you get good Who.

I also like the sound of the writer Juno Dawson, trans herself so her trans character sounds authentic and believable. And her enthusiasm for Who is clear enough -

“Being from Bradford myself, I adore hearing regional accents on the BBC,” she says. “I love that Doctor Who has lived its life in Cardiff, Sheffield and Liverpool in recent years. That regionality isn’t there enough in BBC drama, which is often kind of placeless. So, before I even thought about their gender or sexual identity, it was important to me that they were from different parts of the UK. Shawna was specified in the script as being a black or mixed-race woman from the north, whereas Abby was always going to be from Glasgow, which is one of my favourite cities.
“The three loser-teers”, as they self-deprecatingly style themselves, discover that everyone who has ever met the Doctor is disappearing, their very existence being forgotten. They’re being “redacted from reality”. Is there an allegorical significance here? “Somewhat,” says Dawson. “The notion of being silenced or erased feels part of the online language nowadays. But, I would say to the listener: it’s Doctor Who, don’t read too much into it. It’s more about a threat hanging over the world.”
“I wanted to highlight that Cleo’s had a difficult old life but, like Charlie, has developed a thick skin to hide her pain. That’s something that Russell T Davies did particularly well. If you make the humans’ lives feel real and layered, then, somehow, the sci-fi feels more real as well. There’s something delicious about seeing a Yeti on the tube or a Dalek going over Tower Bridge. It’s the extraordinary mixed with the ordinary. I wanted the characters to feel like your nextdoor neighbours.”
“When I watched Bonnie Langford [who played companion Mel] as a kid, I decided I wanted to be her,” she says. “And then Sophie Aldred came along as Ace, an even stronger character who killed Daleks with a baseball bat. Long before I knew I was a girl, I knew I was Mel and Ace. The show had a huge impact on me, so it’s a privilege to put my own little flag on the landscape.”
“It was such a thrill to play with these beloved characters,” says Dawson. “It’s like borrowing someone else’s toy box. As long as you give the toys back in mint condition, you can just go mad. I was in the next room as Jodie was recording my dialogue, and admit I cried. I never cry! I never thought in a million years I’d get to see the Doctor reading dialogue I’d written for them.”

That last bit reminds me of how Gaiman said he felt the first time he got to sit down and type 'Interior TARDIS. Enter the Doctor.'

So yeah Id say her Who credentials are bone fide- she can write decent characters, its a decent story so far and set up and its good fun - everything Who should be. }}

by Mrs Figg Sun May 01, 2022 2:46 pm

I am Totally 100% against promoting sexuality and gender dysphoria to kids as a lifestyle choice. I don't care how good the characters are, it makes gender dysphoria fashionable. The younger generation is already captured by adults pushing their alternative sexuality on chlldren. Sexuality and gender dysphoria should not be promoted to children through children's programming. I am sick and tired of this crap and find it morally reprehensible. I want kids to be kids and innocent of adult fuckery. Nothing wrong with homosexuality and trans, and I fully support and follow the LGB Alliance, but leave it out of kids TV.

by Pettytyrant101 Sun May 01, 2022 2:55 pm

{{ By that measure then heterosexuality should likewise be left out of childrens tv- so no 10 and Rose, no 11 and River, no Amy and Rory. Why are those relationships not morally reprehensible in childrens tv? }}