Ten Fucking Years
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Norc
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by Gandalf's Beard Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:42 pm
Hidden hero my arse! 
He was a vindictive abusive psychopath till the last. He was just a bad-guy who switched sides because he got the girl he liked killed. If he was a good guy who actually respected Lily though, he would have treated Harry a lot better. Snape was a cruel, selfish bastard who only cared about his own sense of loss.
Think about it--Snape is the one responsible for putting a target on Harry's back, and 1/3 responsible for making Harry an orphan. And then he treated Harry like trash for seven years. You have to be a bit of a psychopath to be that cruel.
The best you can say is that Snape is a great literary antihero. He's a very compelling character.
He was a vindictive abusive psychopath till the last. He was just a bad-guy who switched sides because he got the girl he liked killed. If he was a good guy who actually respected Lily though, he would have treated Harry a lot better. Snape was a cruel, selfish bastard who only cared about his own sense of loss.
Think about it--Snape is the one responsible for putting a target on Harry's back, and 1/3 responsible for making Harry an orphan. And then he treated Harry like trash for seven years. You have to be a bit of a psychopath to be that cruel.
The best you can say is that Snape is a great literary antihero. He's a very compelling character.
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by halfwise Mon Jan 21, 2019 4:30 pm
Harry represented what Snape most wanted and couldn't get; and Harry's dad treated Snape with all the scumbaggery we see coming out of Snape later. It makes psychological sense. Another nice turn-around that JK pulled off is having Harry find out his idolized father wasn't all that nice a person all the time.
So Snape becomes the villain you can sympathize with, and a realistic hero: someone who you can't figure if you like him or not, but you feel some compassion for and it puzzles you. Such complex depth is a rarity in a children's book, and is JK's greatest accomplishment.
So Snape becomes the villain you can sympathize with, and a realistic hero: someone who you can't figure if you like him or not, but you feel some compassion for and it puzzles you. Such complex depth is a rarity in a children's book, and is JK's greatest accomplishment.
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by Eldy Mon Jan 21, 2019 4:52 pm
Snape abused most of his students (Slytherins generally excepted). He was Neville's worst fear in the whole world when the kid was 13.* Snape was a terrible human being with a shitty upbringing that goes some way towards explaining the way he turned out but does not excuse all the things he did. Certainly a compelling character and one I enjoyed reading about, but he was not "good" and he most definitely does not deserve the praise and treatment he receives from a certain segment of HP fandom/the fanfic community.
I can feel empathy for Snape having endured severe bullying at school for years as well as (from the brief glimpses we get) probably growing up in an abusive household--at the very least, a seriously dysfunctional one. Sadly, people who were abused going on to abuse others is a fairly common occurrence, but the fact that we can sympathize with parts of their experience doesn't mean the experiences of their own victims should be discounted. HP in general tends not to acknowledge the seriousness of child abuse when it occurs, though.
- *Footnote:
- Let's not forget his treatment of Hermione either:Snape examined Goyle, whose face now resembled something that would have been at home in a book on poisonous fungi.
"Hospital wing, Goyle," Snape said calmly.
"Malfoy got Hermione!" Ron said. "Look!"
He forced Hermione to show Snape her teeth - she was doing her best to hide them with her hands, though this was difficult as they had now grown down past her collar. Pansy Parkinson and the other Slytherin girls were doubled up with silent giggles, pointing at Hermione from behind Snape's back.
Snape looked coldly at Hermione, then said, "I see no difference."
Hermione let out a whimper; her eyes filled with tears, she turned on her heel and ran, ran all the way up the corridor and out of sight.
It was lucky, perhaps, that both Harry and Ron started shouting at Snape at the same time; lucky their voices echoed so much in the stone corridor, for in the confused din, it was impossible for him to hear exactly what they were calling him. He got the gist, however.
"Let's see," he said, in his silkiest voice. "Fifty points from Gryffindor and a detention each for Potter and Weasley. Now get inside, or it'll be a week's worth of detentions."
I can feel empathy for Snape having endured severe bullying at school for years as well as (from the brief glimpses we get) probably growing up in an abusive household--at the very least, a seriously dysfunctional one. Sadly, people who were abused going on to abuse others is a fairly common occurrence, but the fact that we can sympathize with parts of their experience doesn't mean the experiences of their own victims should be discounted. HP in general tends not to acknowledge the seriousness of child abuse when it occurs, though.
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by halfwise Mon Jan 21, 2019 5:47 pm
Welcome to the first Norcing of the new year! 
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by Amarië Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:01 pm
halfwise wrote:Welcome to the first Norcing of the new year!
*sniffles* It's so beautiful!
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by Mrs Figg Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:19 pm
I get all your points about Snape being an abuser because he had had a shtity childhood being bullied, but the one thing he lacked as an adult was a legitimate way out of the cycle of abusing. From what I read about Hogwarts it was like an enclosed Oxford college full of dusty professors and was surrounded by children which allowed him to be a bully. if he had worked in the Ministry for Magic and had been surrounded by adults and eligible females he might have been different or broken the cycle. He might however just bullied his work colleagues. But in an adult environment he might have been challenged more and made to think. I think he would have been a loner no matter what and being surrounded by couples might even made him worse. He is a complex character and Halfy is right, he is her greatest achievement.
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by Gandalf's Beard Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:24 pm
Snape was NOT an innocent victim when he went to Hogwarts.
He was a vicious little racist thug who was part of a gang of junior death munchers who terrorised muggleborns and molested girls with dark magic.
I can empathise with Snape's shitty home life before Hogwarts, but he was a horrific neo-Nazi youth at school and then he became a neo-Nazi Terrorist.
When James "bullied" Snape, he didn't do anything to Snape which Snape hadn't already done to him, and undoubtedly many "Mudblood" students. Snape invented the spell that James used on him. Meaning that James was simply retaliating for prior incidents.
Details with chapter citations here:
https://www.quora.com/Is-there-evidence-in-the-Harry-Potter-books-that-Snape-was-a-bully-as-a-kid/answer/Nathan-Beard-6
He was a vicious little racist thug who was part of a gang of junior death munchers who terrorised muggleborns and molested girls with dark magic.
I can empathise with Snape's shitty home life before Hogwarts, but he was a horrific neo-Nazi youth at school and then he became a neo-Nazi Terrorist.
When James "bullied" Snape, he didn't do anything to Snape which Snape hadn't already done to him, and undoubtedly many "Mudblood" students. Snape invented the spell that James used on him. Meaning that James was simply retaliating for prior incidents.
Details with chapter citations here:
https://www.quora.com/Is-there-evidence-in-the-Harry-Potter-books-that-Snape-was-a-bully-as-a-kid/answer/Nathan-Beard-6
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by Norc Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:56 pm
ah yes totally agree! and as eldy pointet out, a lot of the HP-fandom really loves Snaoe and i cannot figure out why. maybe for the same reason people romantizise christian gray? i do remember however when i read that plot-twist and being like really mind fucked and for a second really liking the snape character but yeah.. he is an asshole and a terrible teacher..Gandalf's Beard wrote:Snape was NOT an innocent victim when he went to Hogwarts.
He was a vicious little racist thug who was part of a gang of junior death munchers who terrorised muggleborns and molested girls with dark magic.
I can empathise with Snape's shitty home life before Hogwarts, but he was a horrific neo-Nazi youth at school and then he became a neo-Nazi Terrorist.
When James "bullied" Snape, he didn't do anything to Snape which Snape hadn't already done to him, and undoubtedly many "Mudblood" students. Snape invented the spell that James used on him. Meaning that James was simply retaliating for prior incidents.
Details with chapter citations here:
https://www.quora.com/Is-there-evidence-in-the-Harry-Potter-books-that-Snape-was-a-bully-as-a-kid/answer/Nathan-Beard-6
totally loving the norcing here.
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by Norc Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:57 pm
... i read a great drarry fanfic once.Amarië wrote:Merlin's beard! Gandalf's beard! I guess it was the newsletter that lured you back?
I am afraid I agree that Harry and Hermione would have made a great couple. But that is food for fanfics, canon should remain canon.
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by Norc Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:00 pm
yes, a hidden hero. an asshole. but a redeeming asshole.halfwise wrote:Hey - I thought turning Snape into the hidden hero of HP was one of JK's grandest accomplishments!
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by Amarië Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:02 pm
Reminds me I wanted to ask what Eldy's ship is.
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"Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth."
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by halfwise Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:17 pm
Many people who are little shits as children grow out of it as they get older. I think Figgs has a good point about being cooped up in Hogwarts.
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by Eldy Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:49 pm
Amarië wrote:Reminds me I wanted to ask what Eldy's ship is.
Aberforth/Aberforth's goat #believe
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by Forest Shepherd Tue Jan 22, 2019 3:59 am
rofl
(Hi GB)
(Hi GB)
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by halfwise Thu Feb 07, 2019 1:17 pm
I just wanted to point out that for the first time in, I dunno, years at least....I woke up, looked at the Forum, and saw more entries in the Tolkien section than in the non-Tolkien section! 
Made me feel good, it did.
With Elthir and Lorient both reappearing we're out of our Who/politics rut!
Made me feel good, it did.With Elthir and Lorient both reappearing we're out of our Who/politics rut!
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by Amarië Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:31 pm
Yey!!
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by azriel Thu Feb 07, 2019 5:10 pm
All I can say Halfy is, Variety. And there seems to be shed loads of it here Im now starting to look forward to the new Tolkien film due out in this Spring. Im looking forward to it more than I did the Hobbshit, just hope I wont feel let down. IL chuck up if it goes all Hollywood glossy & airbrushed.
Im now starting to look forward to the new Tolkien film due out in this Spring. Im looking forward to it more than I did the Hobbshit, just hope I wont feel let down. IL chuck up if it goes all Hollywood glossy & airbrushed. _________________
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by Eldy Thu Feb 11, 2021 6:44 am
and now it's been 10 years since dark planet day
(what the fuck 2011 was not a decade ago, come on)
(what the fuck 2011 was not a decade ago, come on)
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by azriel Thu Feb 11, 2021 9:57 am
The years are in conspiracy, they are ganging up on us. Theyve scraped all the even numbers & we only get odd numbers, ( Ive noticed I remember odd numbers better than even ? )
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by Pettytyrant101 Thu Feb 11, 2021 4:25 pm
{{ Eldy!!! Good to know you're still hovering over the forum and keeping an ex-Admins eye on the record keeping 
And I dont want to worry you, but those ten years they go faster and faster as you age
I remember Dark Planet Day like it was yesterday, I was drunk, I know that for sure because I distinctly remember it was a...well, a day 
Wonder where Odo's got to? He usually shows up on the anniversary of Dark Planet Day to take the credit }}
Good to know you're still hovering over the forum and keeping an ex-Admins eye on the record keeping And I dont want to worry you, but those ten years they go faster and faster as you age
I remember Dark Planet Day like it was yesterday, I was drunk, I know that for sure because I distinctly remember it was a...well, a day
Wonder where Odo's got to? He usually shows up on the anniversary of Dark Planet Day to take the credit
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by halfwise Thu Feb 11, 2021 4:58 pm
Oh, now I know why I wasn't around on Dark Planet Day. i had started teaching some course or other, and it was too much to prepare for that and keep up with Forumshire.
Hiya Eldy!
Hiya Eldy!
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by Amarië Thu Feb 11, 2021 8:40 pm
What would we do without you, Eldy?
10 years... Certainly gets you thinking...
10 years... Certainly gets you thinking...
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Re: Ten Fucking Years
by Bluebottle Thu Feb 11, 2021 9:01 pm
I don't remember any dark planet, only a grey forum 
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