All New Who

I haven't read any of the Virgin books, but I've read around half of the BBC 8th Doctor novels so far, there are some absolutely brilliant stories in the novels (Vampire Science, The Bodysnatchers, Alien Bodies, Seeing I, The Scarlet Empress. Demontage and The Shadows Of Avalon being stand outs so far) and Fitz Kriener is quite possibly my favourite male companion, so if you have a few quid going spare or come across some of the novels by *cough* other means *cough* I'd reccomend checking out a few of the 'wilderness years' novels sometime, as they kept Who active in the public/fanbase's consciousness long before even Big Finish got started.

{{I read the TARGET novelizations of episodes as a kid, and some of the Virgin New Adventures (think those are the same as above- are these reprints of the originals?) well worth a read }}}

{{{This struck me of a perfect example of the sometimes ludicrous position the head writer of Who can find themselves in because Head Writer is not head of the show- thats the BBC suits.
When Moffat was asked by the BBC to do a first draft for the Doctor Who 50th Anniversary episode Day of the Doctor it came with a caveat- he could only include the actors signed on at that time.

Which was Jenna Coleman.

Yup, you read that right, out there somewhere is a script Moffat had to waste time writing for the suits, for the 50th Anniversary with no Doctors in it at all, only Clara.
The mind boggles at how a BBC exec's thinking actually works }}}}

{{{Interesting developments regards the potential shape of the Chibnall era and how Who is written}}

'Doctor Who could be scripted by an American-style "writers room" for the first time when Chris Chibnall takes the reins of the show for series 11 in 2018, RadioTimes.com can exclusively reveal.

Chibnall has been discussing numerous ideas about how the show will be scripted. And while he remains committed to writing episodes on his own he is understood to have been examining the possibility of a writers room for some instalments of the flagship sci-fi drama.

The BBC has already met with the Writers' Guild of Great Britain [WGGB] - the union for professional scriptwriters - to discuss new approaches to writing the scripts.

“If it’s what the BBC wants and it’s what the writers want it then it’s fine by us,” said Bernie Corbett, who was general secretary of the union when the BBC discussed the ideas with his organisation.

“Nobody’s against it. Lots of writers would like to try it but you have to get round those practical difficulties. Our job as a Trade Union is not to disrupt things or hold things back if they think it is a good idea."

A BBC spokesperson said: “It’s still very early days and no fixed model has been decided upon yet. Chris Chibnall as the new showrunner will write his own episodes and is currently exploring different ways of working with new and established writers on the show. “

In 2008 Doctor Who writer Paul Cornell, who scripted the double episode Human Nature and Family of Blood for David Tennant’s Doctor in 2007, called for the show to be written by a group of paid writers.

In an interview with the BBC’s Writersroom website he said: “There's all sorts of reasons that doesn't happen in Britain, one of which is that we've produced much shorter runs of things. We have a showrunner and a bunch of freelancers who are doing other things at the same time, who don't clock in and aren't paid a wage but are just paid for their script. Some of that is, I think, down to the old-fashioned gentlemen and players thing, that writers are still not quite seen as employees."

Russell T Davies introduced the showrunner idea to Doctor Who when he took over the rebooted series in 2005 but stopped short of introducing a writers room.

Under the system he mapped out the whole series, then divided episodes between a pool of writers. There was no formally organised collaboration although there were regular meetings to discuss tone and to engage in read-throughs of completed scripts.

This system has largely been maintained by current showrunner Steven Moffat.

Corbett added that the introduction of the new system – which is favoured in the US but is virtually unheard of in the UK – was a potentially exciting development.

He added: ”In Britain writers tend to be more individuals and in the US there is a concentration of production talent in LA and New York. Our writers tend to live all over the place in London, in Bristol, Bath and Durham and it may be difficult for them to attend a writers room. But if they can all come together to work on the show then it sounds like a great idea.”

However Corbett cautioned that because many UK-based writers are dispersed across the country it could make it difficult to construct a "workplace writers room" in the UK in the same way they can in the US.

He added that UK writers tend have low incomes so it would be impossible for them to relocate to London unless the pay was at "LA levels."

“They might not want to and if that happened it would distort the market throughout the UK," he said.

“Also [writers rooms] are expensive and they tend to have big dollars in the US with long running shows. Doctor Who is in many ways a show that is perhaps moving towards that kind of scale as US shows so it seems a good fit. It’s not that we don’t want to do it in the UK, but it is about scale.

“Three writers is not a writers room it is a relationship but a writers room is in a sense, though not in a bad way, a factory of writing. It’s a big step.'- Radio Times


{{{I am in two minds about this- I have never been a big fan of the US writers room thing- yes it has produced some quality work, but often for me it lacks a voice because there is no single writer lending it a voice. Who has always been written essentially by freelancers chosen by the head writer of the day- the downside to this is you sometimes get a lack of consistency between episodes, but the up side is a far greater range of individuality to stories and characters. And Who lives or dies on it being individual, on it being a bit different every week with a different perspective every week. Really not sure about this idea at all. Mmmmmm}}}

{{Really like this fan made sfx- de-materializing and materializing from the pov of the TARDIS}}

I think the way the show has been written recently highlights the hit and miss and confused episodes we have had since at least the last Smith and all the Capaldi seasons. It has fluctuated from ok to downright crappy from episode to episode and its been all over the place, so I would welcome a more democratic approach rather than top down with a few minions making things up as they go along, as they have been hampered by the top dog poo pooing some ideas, things getting watered down or changed too much, or a writer trying too hard to make his or her mark and it ending up bizarre. Bring on the writers room I say. That way it can be planned and will flow better, and character arcs actually make sense. they will also be able to field imaginative and fresh ideas.

{{{Its not just been that way with Moffat but RTD and others before him. And your view on the episodes since Smith are your personal view not really relevant to the basic merits of a writer room or not as you liked RTD era and that was runm the same way as Moffat era- at least a head writer gives direction and tone- it puts a stamp on it- that's why you can tell Moffat era so clearly from RTD, or either of them from JNT or Douglas Adams.

A Writers Room risks a blandness creeping in, a sameness which you so often see in US shows after a series- especially if you take all your writers and bung them altogether in London - after a while they are all drawing on largely the same social experiences and viewpoints, whereas right now Who writers can be writing from anywhere in the world, from different social and political climates and so the variety of ideas remains wider.
And what happens to writers from outside the UK? Would we not have got Gaiman's superb Doctor's Wife if he could not have gone to be in the Writers Room for x amount of time to do it? (he wrote it in the US where he lives and works) As I say, I am not wholly opposed to the idea in general, it has produced some quality TV in the US, but I am wary for it in Who where variety is its life blood}}}

The Doctors Wife was good, but his last effort Nightmare in Silver was boring and had the most irritating character in Who history, and something is clearly not working. The Seinfeld show didn't have a writers room and each writer thought up their own episode, but its all quite clearly Seinfeld and it flows beautifully, but Who doesn't, its all over the shop, and each episode is just plonked in next to each other and are wildly diverse which makes it seem choppy. maybe they need a middle ground.

{{You say something is clearly not right but the general consensus about series 9 is that it was very well received, I personally thought it was very good indeed, as a series probably my favourite since 5. So I dont think personal opinion about the series is very helpful either way in discussing the merits of a writers room- as clearly there is a stong difference of opinion on if the current way of dong is producing good or bad results- you an I are perfect examples- you would say yes it was with RTD but it doesn't work with Moffat, I'd be inclined to say the opposite.
What might be a good compromise is creating a small Writers room for series arc episodes and plotting out character arcs per episode, but then farming the stand alone episodes of the series out as usual to the freelancers- this allows you access to writers who want to do it, but cant because of other commitments elsewhere (but even then  am still unsure about it for Who, and its just not how British writers have ever worked before, where its tended to be either a writer on their own or a writing partnership- whether that's Dennis Potter, Bennett, Perry and Croft, Russell T Davies or Steven Moffat, heck even Chibnall is best known for writing a series himself- Broadchurch.
There also seems a risk to me that you make it harder for new writers in TV to get stuff done if we down the US route of writers rooms- then it becomes about getting into a writers room for a show rather than creating your own product and vision in your own series- we might lose an aspect of British drama that's still quite unique- the single voice writer- I assume this is why the Writers Union had to be consulted on even just the idea of doing it}}}

only they are suggesting it for Who and not all tv shows in the future of the universe. Chibnall has probably suggested this because he knows that Moffat was running on empty by the end of his run and it showed. Moffats energies were divided between Who and Sherlock, having a writing room takes the pressure off a head writer, it allows for ideas to be thought through rather than waved through due to tiredness or desperation. if a crappy idea is put forward its going to get exterminated rather than as sometimes happens, (naming no Kill the Moon fucking stupidity) and it actually getting filmed.

naming no Kill the Moon fucking stupidity- Figg

{{{Many would say the worst episode of that series was Forest of the Night- an episode I recall you liked- my point being its clearly subjective as to if the way the show has been written all this time is really a factor here at all}}

'because he knows that Moffat was running on empty by the end of his run and it showed.'

{{{But again, Moffats most recent series of Who is among his best received by fans and critics so claiming he is running on empty is again a subjective viewpoint- it was not a series which struck me as lacking in inventiveness, imagination, or ideas}}}

Forest of the Night could have been great but I think it got tweeked. and NOBODY likes Kill the Moon apart from you.

and NOBODY likes Kill the Moon apart from you- Figg

{{I beg to differ- looking at the voting on Gallifrey Base for the two episodes.

Moon out of 3612 votes cast 533 gave it an 8 out of 10 with 22.74% of the vote- worth noting it is a divisive episode with 87 (2.7% giving it 1 out of 10, 98 giving it 2/10 (3.10%) and 194 (6.14%) 3/10.

Forest however only gets of 2997 votes cast with 533 rating it a 7 out of 10. Which is 17.78% of the vote.
But 215 (7.17%) gave it a 1/10, 197 gave it 2/10 (6.57%) and 351 gave it a 3 out of 10 (11.71%)

On Gallifrey Base at least the least popular of the two was Forest, its clear both episodes are Marmite ones however, but even so a majority (though only just in Forests case) still scored both episodes above average rather than below}}}

Both Forest and Moon are good examples of where I think a writer's room could really help. Both had a fantasy story-line that could make young viewers look at the world around them with fresh eyes (what fantasy does best!) But both broke the magic spell and had me shouting things like "Oxygen doesn't work like that!" and "Gravity doesn't work like that!" A writer with at least a high school physics or chemistry background in the room could have easily fixed both.

Look what I got for my birthday!!




I opened the cover, looked at the cogwheels and heard the Who theme song in my head. I'm not at all worried about my mental health.

{{{David- I see what you are saying on those two episodes, but to be devils advocate could it not be seen as curbing the style of the writers? Both writers have show a tendency towards promoting the thematic and the deeper meaning, with the plot essentially just being the playground for it to occur in- in the case of Moon we have a tale about the right to life, the three traditional stages of womanhood making the chose, and a few other arc related themes. Is it really the physics that breaks the magic or its application to the known.
It has been pointed out that if it was the moon orbiting planet Zog it would work fine because we don't know what that moon is supposed to be like. Though you'd have to spend more time at the start setting up the stakes. My point is does it need a writers room to make those suggestions? And how much freedom should a showruner give to his writers?- Moffat has always told his writers not to treat it as as some cherished thing, but to treat it as their show, their episode, and their take on it. This offers lots of variety and perspective, but can make for large changes of tone between episodes- I happen to like that, classic had similar large jumps in tone between stories.
I fear a writers room in smoothing out these things would instead make it too smooth, too bland, too streamlined for the marketplace, but not edgy, take a risk and sometimes fall trying, push the envelope a bit Who}}}

{{Amarie- thats a lovely edition (if memory serves all the stories in it have been referenced somewhere in the shows 50 odd years in some way or another)}}}

Pettytyrant101 wrote:
{{I beg to differ- looking at the voting on Gallifrey Base for the two episodes.

Do you have an account on GB? I joined a few months ago (my username is Thornybacon)

Kill the Moon had great acting and cinematography and a admirably ludricous premise, but the social commentary was far too in your face and the execution fell completely flat i.m.o...

{{Yeah I've been on there a few years now, though I haven't posted much, though I do vote- like many there I tend not to bother posting- the general trend for the episode review thread is page after page of 'Moffat must go' interspersed with the odd genuine good post (I like those by Chris Kirby- hope that's right) , but giving the overall impression it was the worst thing ever- then you glance up at the votes and how many voted and see, as is normally the case, a majority enjoyed it again  

I tend to agree on the social commentary being a bit strong, the same charge cold be levelled at this series Zygon two parter- but I think it has a more genuine case for explaining the premise and helping draw the parallels for the younger viewers in a clear way- but both episodes, Moon and Forest, much of the good stuff is in the character stuff especially in Forest which actually has some excellent stuff between the three adult leads in terms of character development- but its sort of lost in the premise}}}

Scherzo is a masterpiece:

(I do like the War Doctor theme (it sounds vaguely Star Warsy to me) but I think it should have had a stornger underlying sense of tragedy or menace...)

Pettytyrant101 wrote:{{Yeah I've been on there a few years now, though I haven't posted much, though I do vote- like many there I tend not to bother posting- the general trend for the episode review thread is page after page of 'Moffat must go' interspersed with the odd genuine good post (I like those by Chris Kirby- hope that's right) , but giving the overall impression it was the worst thing ever- then you glance up at the votes and how many voted and see, as is normally the case, a majority enjoyed it again  

I've noticed that, some posters there (and elsewhere) never seem happier than when they are moaning about the show (the level of bile I've seen directed at RTD/Moffat/Tennant/Adric etc is astonishing, it's a slighly campy family friendly escapism for god's sake! not oscar worthy hard sci fi!), at least here where many of us dislike aspects of the Jackson Tolkien adaptations we have fun in the process...

The social commentary in Moon was cack-handed at best and worryingly obtuse at worst.

Big Finish's Doctor Who/Torchwood license renewed through to 2025!:

https://www.bigfinish.com/news/v/doctor-who-licence-extended-to-2025

Big Finish Productions is delighted to announce that its licence from BBC Worldwide to make original Doctor Who and Torchwood dramas on audio has been extended until June 20th 2025!

Big Finish released its first Doctor Who audio production, Doctor Who: The Sirens of Time, in 1999. 17 years and many hundreds of productions later, Big Finish continues to go from strength to strength, telling audio adventures of the first eleven incarnations of the Doctor and their companions, and exploring the great history of Torchwood.

'We very much look forward to continuing to work with Big Finish over the coming years,' says Jan Paterson, Head of Audio Publishing at BBC Worldwide. 'The high standards of their productions — quality scripts, impeccable sound design and music, and impressive casting that utilises some of the country’s biggest stars — are a reflection of the care and thought that goes into every audio.'

'It is very rare that a production company is given the luxury of being able to plan so far ahead,' says Big Finish Executive Producer Jason Haigh-Ellery. 'Thanks to the faith placed in Big Finish by the BBC we can look forward to many years of story progression and real character development for the Doctors and their companions. We are excited about what the future holds and look forward to the next decade of adventures travelling in time and space.'

'Doctor Who is my favourite thing,' says Executive Producer — and voice of the Daleks — Nicholas Briggs. 'It’s been with me all my life in one form or another. So it’s truly delightful for me that the good old BBC has given us permission to carry on space-time travelling.'

'It’s such an honour for us to tell new stories in the worlds of Doctor Who and Torchwood,' says line producer David Richardson. 'The possibilities truly are endless, the potential for ideas is infinite. It’s a wonderful feeling when we have been doing this for seventeen years, yet feel like we’ve only just begun and that the best is yet to come.'

Forthcoming highlights from Big Finish include the return of David Tennant and Catherine Tate as the Tenth Doctor and Donna Noble in The Tenth Doctor Adventures, three brand new full-cast audios available from May 16th. John Hurt returns as the War Doctor in four box-sets, with Doctor Who – The War Doctor: Only the Monstrous and Doctor Who – The War Doctor: Infernal Devices currently available to buy and download.

Tom Baker, Peter Davison, Colin Baker, Sylvester McCoy and Paul McGann regularly record new adventures, alongside their television companions. Alex Kingston returns as archaeologist River Song in The Diary of River Song, alongside the Classic Doctors. Jemma Redgrave and Ingrid Oliver play Kate Stewart and Osgood in the action-packed UNIT: The New Series.

The audio adventures of Torchwood were launched to great acclaim in September 2015, based on the popular spin-off series by Russell T Davies. To date series stars John Barrowman, Eve Myles, Gareth David-Lloyd, Kai Owen and Naoko Mori have all returned to their roles and 2016 and 2017 will see many exciting developments in the range...

You can explore Big Finish's entire range of Doctor Who and Torchwood titles on our website today. For further news and update from the Worlds of Doctor Who, you can subscribe to the Big Finish Newsletter.

As they started working in the Doctor Who universe by writing/adapting Bernice Summerfield (a companion of the 7th Doctor in the Virgin New Adventures Novels) stories back in 1998 this license renewal means that they will have outlasted the entire run of the Classic Series, very impressive considering they are a fan-founded company and originally only estimated they'd run for three years...

Interesting to note Hurt and Tennant have been added to the banner, presumably they've committed to doing more audios...

telling audio adventures of the first eleven incarnations of the Doctor and their companions,

Hint towards Eccleston? They've done a couple of 9th Doctor stories narrated from other characters point of view, but for me 9th Doctor stories wouldn't be that interesting without the man himself...

and 2016 and 2017 will see many exciting developments in the range...

Torchwood Series 5 perhaps?

{{Good news all round for BF- they deserve it, they have more than proved their ability. Got to hope Eccy will do it eventually, but I wont hold my breath for it either, as that makes it too tricky to drink! And if they get Matt Smith who will be his companions? Getting Karen Gillan back especially might be tricky and hard to imagine 11 with no Amy and Rory and hard to do it with Clara- it would be like when they did the Lost Stories for 6, they'd have to make her like she was when she was with 11, which was not her best, and they couldn't really develop her more over time like they did 6 because thats the story-arc of her time on the tv show}}}}}