My 'Hobbit BO5A' review.

Ayup All...

Reviews of any kind are subjective to the reviewers prejudices and background, and taking others on board is oh so easy, especially nowadays behind a keyboard in the Internet age. And not that I hide behind mine, but all I'll say is that when you're pleasantly surprised, you have to acknowledge it. And I do.

I went and saw the Hobbit last night in 3D. (which was better this time and more pronounced, but that wasnt the reason for going.) and I ENJOYED IT. yes, Eru help me, I Enjoyed it. There were bits I didnt like, quotes that I thought could have been included, but there were a coupla book Quotes that were in the right place, and I think, with other stuff, that they made the thing work. Now you're All welcome to call me a Hypocrite, and I accept that, but I can't get past it that I enjoyed 'The Epilog'. And for all the comments about things like Sarumans 'Kung Fu' fighting (which I didnt see really, just a little staff fighting, like in Robin Hood), and Saurons 'part', they were minor if almost insignificant details, which for me, didnt Impinge on the story at all, and I caught myself thinking, 'What the hell was all the fuss about THAT for ?' Talk about prejudice eh ?

I thought the film sorta stuttered to life, as if I'd pressed the pause button on the DVD player twelve months ago and forgotten about it, then after Laketown its Impetus gained considerably and by almost the end of the film (the Ravenhill fight) I felt that it was really coming to life. I found the films 'politics' not as dark as I'd been led to believe, and Richard Armitage did a fantastic job of being paranoid. He really did have a brooding menace, was hungry for violence, and really came out beyond his costume as a character. This too I found of Aidan Turner, as Killi chasing Tauriel, and Dean o Gorman as Fili. Who, when actually given something to do, came out of their costumes as well. And I got the feeling that all the other Dwarf actors would have done so had they been given the chance. Cate B as Galadriel SCARED the bejesus out of me as the 'Nasty' Galadriel, but bought up the Question of why, if she could be like that, why didnt Gandalf just take her along from when he first got to Rivendell after the Moon Runes scene... and how much more powerful than Saruman she was. As a simple Elf woman... But these points have been noted by real film critics, that all these type of loose ends had just been sorta swept aside to get the third film done, and I agree with that.

The climactic scenes around Ravenhill were very violent and very good. Azog having a dynamic demise and resurrection and then a good finish ! Bolg similarly too. I didnt have a terrible problem with Legolas climbing and killing Mumaks in the Pelennor, so I didnt really have a problem with hitching a ride with a Vampire bat. The worst bit was the awful animation of Leggys' 'Lara Croft' dash across the crumbling tower. that was bad CGI, rather than bad action. And at Killis demise I had a real lump in my throat for him and Tauriel. Especially for her. And that wasn't supposed to happen. Richard Armitage and Martin Freeman doing a stirling job on Thorins death scene too. with the right words at the right time, and not some approximation.

I'd like to say that the principles acted a storm too. Luke Evans was a fantastic Bard, whose character just wasn't set up right in DOS. And even Alfrid worked on a strange level, But Thranduils character seemed too messed up and all over the place, but not Lee Paces rendition. The biggest disappointment of all was Billy Connoly, who was made to ham up his 'Eh, yous, Jimmy' stage routine. when he gave his opening speech, I accidentally shouted 'Fuck off' to the auditorium and was told off by the folks behind me. I missed Bards 'Black Arrow' speech in Laketown terribly, Carcs part in fetching Dain and a Carc/Roac flashback, and disliked the fact that they bigged the Eagles up in size even more than in AUJ. I loved Beorns five second Cameo and would have liked more of that, but then there may be in the EE. I hope so.

So I'm glad to be pleasantly surprised. But the Hobbit STILL should have been two films, not three, or if three, better divided up. The Gold dwarf thing in DOS is still an abomination unto Tolkien though. And Goblin Town..  

My final word is to say that Although PJ has taken liberties with TH, somehow I came to CARE for one character in his films that I shouldnt have, having being invented by him and his coven, and that, if nothing, is an achievement. I do look forward eventually, to sit down and watch, when I finally get them, the 3D, EE Blu-Ray of all three films, to watch one after the other, then I can pass judgement finally. I still don't want his ass anywhere near the Silmarillion though.

Glad you liked it feanor. Much more forgiving than I am. Which I won't get into what I felt here, might as well let there be one positive review of the damn thing somewhere here.

I'm glad you found things you enjoyed in the film, Feanor. I probably spent too much time in my review focusing on the negatives and too little on the (few) things that I liked, so I'm glad to see a more positive review up. More positive by Forumshire standards, that is.

Ayup Sin...

Thing is for me, that these three films have followed almost the exact path of the original trilogy. AUJ is way in front as the best of the three, like Fellowship. DOS is an awful middle film, like ROTK (for me) is the worst of the original Trilogy, and BO5A is on a par with TT. not bad, not good. So you get one good, one really bad, one Ugly-ish, LOL !

As I said, I thought Laketown stuttered and the way smaug was depicted was awful. All he had to do was flame Laketown up and down before Bard got his black arrow (Instead of taking it with him and then using his son in an awful William Tell pun ? ) and using that to set up the 'joke' of dropping Smaug on the Master to kill two baddies with one well, arrow if you like. Then onto Dale. I think this is where DOS should have ended.

All the rest of the action is rather rapid, with the small respite at Dol Guldur tripping it up. But once Bard is at Dale, Thranduil quickly turns up too, which is only a slight departure from the book. Although a reasonable departure is that the women of Esgaroth 'Stand by their Men' and stay with them, rather than stay at Esgaroth (and an alive master). Thats a Boyens touch no doubt.

Then we have the main battle in two stages. After the appearance of the ridiculous Dain, and the Were-worms, we get to it. And here I have to ask, WHY weren't the worms used in battle to simply undermine either Dales walls, and/or the ground under Thorins barricade ? they just Bugger off ! And also when the dwarves are on the verge of Annihalation, after Thorins return to sanity, how do 11 fresh dwarves make that much of a difference ?? And then four of them bugger off more or less to Ravenhill. Nastiness ensues, but not before Leggy and Tauriel give Gandy the drop on Angmar, which looked superbly and spectacularly spooky. (Wanted to go there, actually. It reminded me of the witches tower in the Wizard of Oz... ) and then we have the death of Killi, Filli and Thorin, which were well done, and then we were more or less done, without seeing Thorins Crystal Tomb, and then the indecently swift parting of the way for Bilbo and return to Hobbiton, and the casting-off of Tauriel and Legolas. who I thought was wrongly given a really grim outlook compared to his 'sunny' original Trilogy portrayal. I mean even with Killi dead he'd shirley have another shot at Tauriel ?

It was nice to see the Dwarves one last time, and then there was the indecent haste to the end. Bibo having his stuff sold was a nice funny touch, but that grim look to the camera, which undoubtedly was the echo of the ring upon him, and which was upon Ian Holms face too as he welcomed Gandy back into Bag end to start the next part of the Legacy, seemed well out of character for Bilboat that stage of ring ownership. He would have, after all, 60 years to develop his dependency on that evil Ring. Minor points, and it could have been much worse. If only we could re-edit DOS !

Ayup Eldo...

I too went to the pictures Loaded up with negativity, but after Laketown, which really should have been in DOS, it picked up and wasnt half as bad as I was expecting. As i say above there was the odd 'Whatthefuckwasthat' moment, and even other members of the audience shouted out too, but it was an OK end to the Hobbit.

My issue with Kili's death is that he dies for Tauriel. Horrible change IMHO. There are so many ways these films could have stayed closer to the book, while having the same edge as LOTR did. It was sadly never Jackson's intention though to give us Tolkien's story. He felt his feminist co-writers did a more modern take on it so nobody's feelings got hurt. Hate to have a 10 year old girl see one movie without a strong female lead. She might be ruined for life. But then they turn around and instead of Tauriel being a strong female she get heartbroken by the death of a dwarf who wanted to show her what was in his trousers and had only known for a few days. Yeah that's true love.... The were worms were so bad I literally had to walk outside the theater and check the marque to see if I hadn't mistakenly gone into a Dune remake. Some things are just best left as myth. The only thing for me "better" about the new film is, it was shorter.

Glad you liked it though

Ayup Again Sin...

Im with you over Political correctness. But as we dont have a definitive way the way Killi and Filli die in the book, then who's to say ? I DID like the grimmer tone of the whole of BO5A. And the 'Only knew for a few days, and for whats in his pants' are cheap shots. The pants joke IS a stupid one of Jacksees considering the addition of a character like Tauriel for that PC reason, and Im surprised Boyens let that one go. And furthermore you CAN fall in love at first sight, because its happened to me, and doubtless others here too. I've already mentioned the worms and they were on screen mercifully for only a short time.

I too would have loved a closer rendition of the book, and as you say, we could have had that for such a few changes, but the main area to blame is the addition of Azog and Bolg, IMO. And considering how briefly, say, Dol Guldur and the rescuing of Gandalf was, by Galadriel and the white council, I cant believe we had to endure as much as we did of that in DOS. But having said that about Azog and Bolg, It gave us a snappier ending than 'And then a rock hit him on the head and he knew no more...'

I'm mostly of your way of thinking Feanor. There's plenty to grumble about, but I'd been prepared for so much worse!

From the look of the ending sequences, I'd guess most of it was shot very, very early in the filming when there were still only going to be 2 movies and Bilbo (and the book) were still clearly in focus for PJ and Co. And I think his knowing he had to bring the story back to that stake in the ground that he'd set so early is probably the single biggest thing that saved the movie for me.

Still, there's plenty to grumble about (don't even get me started on the wereworms
)

Just the basic physics of things:
I've seen many mooring lines come taut. A heavy laden boat like the master was in should have come to a very slow stop while the line strained and became stretched to something like 2/3 or 1/2 it's diameter, neatly dividing the master into two "links", like a string tied around a raw sausage. Only then would there reasonably be enough force on the line to pull a masonry wall apart like that.

Or Bard's improvised bow.... Leaving aside how an arrow as heavy as that iron black-arrow would fly from a small, lightweight bow like Bards, there's still that stupid scene where he takes the broken halves and jams them into something before drawing it. A bow is carefully carved to distribute what's effectively a point-load shear force ( where the bowman's hand flexes it ) evenly along the length of each arm. If that isn't well designed, the bow will snap. If you break it in the middle and then try to flex it, you've lost ALL that design which made it a bow in the first place. Each arm will snap wherever the force that holds each arm forward is applied. And the thing is, they KNEW this. They had to build it and try it to get the shot, didn't they? I wonder how many times they broke prop bows before they said, "Look, we know this is stupid but it's what PJ wants. Let's just fake it!"

Or where's the firewood for all those braziers in the mountain coming from, and who's packing it??

Or why did the elves jump over the dwarves phalanx, which defeats the whole defensive purpose, rather than shooting at least a few flights of arrows from safely behind it first. What did they carry all those bows and arrows with them for, if they're not going to use them to engage the enemy at a distance???

OK that's enough for now....

Oh, one more thing. I think we should pass a law that every action movie director should be required to dangle by one hand for a specified period of time, then be pulled up by that one hand, before they're allowed to shoot a dangling scene. It ain't easy folks!

The DooglyDoor bit was the very worst bit for me, cant get over what they did to Galadriel.

Well technically feanor they do say Kili and Fili die defending Thorin's body in the book... This is specific in the book.

Todd...

I'd forgot. And I have one of my copies with me here at hand.

But thats gonna be one of those things thats been changed that will rankle like so much does. Can't get past that. But just remember, just because I enjoyed MOST of BO5A, it doesnt turn me into PJs Head Cheerleader, or his biggest fan. OK ?

feanor 1999 wrote:Todd...

I'd forgot. And I have one of my copies with me here at hand.

But thats gonna be one of those things thats been changed that will rankle like so much does. Can't get past that. But just remember, just because I enjoyed MOST of BO5A, it doesnt turn me into  PJs Head Cheerleader, or his biggest fan. OK ?

I hope not I would hate to have to get my torch and pitchfork out...

I would too ...

Honestly I thought Bard was well done, when he took charge of the people of Laketown. I liked most of it other than the way he shot the black arrow and Alfrid  had way too much screen time, I think more than Bilbo, sadly. That and I really missed the lines from the book when Bard did fire the killing shot on Smaug. It would have been so much better and cohesive without so much of Jackson and Boyens crap writing, in place of a story that made sense. While I agree Bard needed to be expanded, I think they worried too much about his kids instead of concentrating on Bard's character.

So many things that I am finding were completely unnecessary to make the transition from page to screen. Once I finish my screenplay I'll post it here for constructive critique, and ask for any ideas on changes. I have no problem with suggestions as long as they make sense. Which is where I have most of my problems with the script Jackson and Co wrote. Compared to the book most of them make no sense.