FREEDOM!!!! [4]

{{ Boris cliams heis all for devolution, but in a meeting with MP's where the subject of devolving mor epower to thenorth of England came up he fought against it saying that devolution had been a 'disaster'.

Now the Tories are trying to spin it as he is all for devoltution, its the SNP that have been a disaster! Too late Boris,you let your cat out the bag. }}

{{ Little update to this story, according to the BBC Boris's comments on devolution have not gone down well even with his own MP's.
The leader of the Scottish conservatives is said to be fuming, seeing it as a gift to the SNP and has tried, vainly it shoud be said, to try to claim he really meant the SNP not devolution has been a disaster.
More pointedly and truthfully the BBC are quoting a 'veteran Scottish Tory' saying- "This is dire - it's totally out of touch and reflects a Westminster-centric view of 1992, not 2020. The anger tonight is palpable and the worst I've ever seen towards a Tory PM."

It also gives fodder to the SNP claim that the Internal Market Bill is a power grab to take powers away from the devolved administrations, as well as calling devolution a disaster he said he saw no good reason why Scotland should ever get any more powers.
If Boris had set out to give the SNP a boost prior to next years Scottish government elections he couldnt have done more. No wonder the Scottish Tories are raging at him.}}

{{ Congratulations and well done to the Scottish Parliament who just made Scotland the first country in the world to end 'period poverty'.

'There is now a legal duty on local authorities to ensure that free items such as tampons and sanitary pads are available to "anyone who needs them".
A survey of more than 2,000 people by Young Scot found that about one in four respondents at school, college or university in Scotland had struggled to access period products.
Meanwhile, about 10% of girls in the UK have been unable to afford period products; 15% have struggled to afford them; and 19% have changed to a less suitable product due to cost, according to research. It also enshrines in law the free provision of period products in schools, colleges and universities.'- BBC Scotland }}

that could be worse than being deprived of toilet paper. Those are high rates of not being able to afford such basics!

Its basic hygiene isn't it, not just for women and girls but everyone. Blood isn't a nice thing to have hanging round. its yucky and very embarrassing being called short.

halfwise wrote:Those are high rates of not being able to afford such basics!

{{ Apprently it can be quite expensive every month and if your at the very poor end of the spectrum can be a choice between sanitary products or food/heating. }}

"There’s a clear mandate for change in @theSNP
& the leadership would do well to listen to the voice of the grassroots #SNPConference2020 #NEC results" - Joanna Cherry
https://twitter.com/joannaccherry/status/1333557241656594437

Can't help to wonder how it is connected to this.

"Half-hearted support from Nicola Sturgeon on #bbcgms for @joannaccherry
whose morning thread revealed threats & intimidation over her stance on women's rights. Hard to see why SNP leader couldn't explicitly back one of her most able & hard-working MPs. Very disappointing."
https://twitter.com/LesleyRiddoch/status/1333336571169435648
https://twitter.com/CraigMurrayOrg/status/1333353865530511360

{{ Blue There was a legal question on the US elections thread for your attention, we were just lamenting your absence over it recently. Glad to see you back.

Its SNP Party conference time, so Id take a lot of what is said at this time with a pinch of salt, always a bit of madness in the air at conference time.

The main beef is same as it was, same as i said this time last year in fact- Sturgeon is taking the push for indy2 slow and steady, and sees getting Westminster ligitimisation for it as necessary to make it legal. A lot of her party dont. They want the vote now if they could have it, and without consent if need be. }}

Tempers still flaring around the Salmon-case (twice exhonorated on charges of misconduct that could not stick up to the level of either civil or criminal scrutiny in a court of law). Apparently the current SNP leadership did not exactly act neutrally, which after the double-exhonoration does not look too good.

https://twitter.com/ChrisMcEleny/status/1336282611614945282

{{ I am waiting to see how this plays out - there were mulitiple accusations made by women against Salmond, I find it hard to believe these were all concoted by the current leadership to somehow get at Salmond- either there is something we dont know yet or the investigations into the allegations were just not done very well (which seems more likely). But given the nature of the accusations I dont see that the leadership had much choice but to investigate, otherwise they would have quite rightly been accused of trying to sweep it under the carpet and protect Salmond. }}

It's neither for me to say what is true or not in a case like this, but I think it is unfair to speculate on Salmond culpability when no accusation has passed the bar either in a civil or criminal context. Furthermore when the allegations have been denied by multiple witness testimonies (claiming to be at dinners where all of those attending deny your presence etc.), not to mention that it is on record that the accusers coordinated among themselves before acting.

As far as the Scottish government concting the whole thing, I do not belive anyone would claim that, but there is plenty of evidence of problematic involvement, and setting up a Government inquiery that was found unlawful and “tainted by apparent bias” by a court of law.  

https://www.thenational.scot/news/18731737.peter-murrell-said-police-pressured-salmond-alleged-leaked-messages/

More worryingly, from my experience from Catalonia, when an independence movement turns fratricidal like this, it normally means that for some independence is no longer the primary aim. Rather, it's power and position.

{{ Internally within the SNP the main issue Sturgeon faces is not going far and fast enough for the independence casue, being too happy to govern as is, refusing to hold a 2nd referndum with or without Westminster consent- her main internal pressure comes from the wing of the party which wants.
The text that refers to were the subject ofhis appeareance yesterday before the committee set up to look into it and he gave a different interpretation of them.

He told the committee the texts to Ms Ruddick were “out of character” and “open to misinterpretation”, adding: “A more appropriate text message back at that point would have been to say they should seek the answers from the police. But that wasn’t the language I used and that’s why I’ve said that I regret using that, because it’s not the right word to use in that context.”

However the main issue of the enquiry is not really about if there was some conspiracy against Salmond, the Tories are trying to get rid of her on a technicality- whether or not the meeting in question she had with Salmond was party business, and therefore could be off the record, or if it was government businees, in which cause it should have been recorded and minuted. As it wasnt minuted they claim she broke the ministerial code and should resign.
Though that shows the brass neck of Tories given Pritti Patel, UK Home Sec was found guilty of having broken the same code just recently and PM Boris backed her and kept her on. }}

This really is a quagmire, and I will not be the one to say one way or another, but there are plenty of texts that needs to be read in good faith. Perhaps most tellingly of all, the Scottish government is now in hotter waters than Salmond, and not giving a great impression of itself.

https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2020/10/the-circle-of-amnesiacs/

{{ As I said Im pretty much waiting for things ot be clearer- Id question the tone of that guys piece mind you - "I am sure it is of great comfort to the ordinary people of Scotland that, as has been clear from this inquiry, the Scottish Government employs an extraordinary plethora of officials, nearly all of them female, in non-jobs with silly titles..."

But if I had to take a bet on how it ill go, Sturgeon will not be fund guilty of anything but acted in good faith, and some officials might go, or at least face reprimands.
There is no evidence of her and Salmond ever having a major falling out, or even a minor one he was her mentor, but in the MeToo era, which was at its height she didnt have much choice in my view but to open an enquiry when people came to her with accusations - whether those people were up to no good and out to get Salmond is for me currently an open question, but I see no evidence Sturgeon herself was, or any motivation for why she would.}}

My view of the actions of the government might be less generous, and more prepared to believe Salmond was targetted, but I aggree this inquiery is unlikely to turn against Sturgeon. Interestingly, as pointed out by Salmond himself in that last link:

"the remit given to your investigation by the Deputy First Minister lays a surprising stress on whether she interfered in the Scottish Government investigation. It might even be suspected that this remit has been set up as a straw man to knock down. There is no general bar on Ministers intervening in a civil service process of which I am aware and indeed there are occasions when Ministers are actually required by the code to intervene to correct civil service behaviour. What I wish to know is whether matters which, by contrast, are specified in the Ministerial code such as the primary responsibility of not misleading Parliament (contrary to 1.3 (c) of the code), such as the failure to act on legal advice suggesting the Government was at risk of behaving unlawful (contrary to 2.30 of the code), and such as the Ministerial failure to ensure civil servants gave truthful information to parliament (contrary to 1.3 (e) of the code) will have at least equal status in your deliberations or are you confined to the political remit which you have been set? If your enquiry has been confined by Ministers then please tell me if you have the authority to expand that remit unilaterally? If not, will you seek the authority of those in the Scottish Government who set the remit to expand it into these, and other, areas?"
https://www.parliament.scot/HarassmentComplaintsCommittee/EMAIL_FROM_ALEX_SALMOND.pdf

Pettytyrant101 wrote:{{ Internally within the SNP the main issue Sturgeon faces is not going far and fast enough for the independence casue, being too happy to govern as is, refusing to hold a 2nd referndum with or without Westminster consent- her main internal pressure comes from the wing of the party which wants. }}

Sadly, in Catalonia "responsibility" has become a byword for "responsible" rendition and even an excuse for pacting with the central government keeping your party leader jailed for political crimes, attacking other independentists as radicals, and postponing independence for another generation, leaving the country defenseless in a cultural, linguistic, political, judicial and economical repressive cycle. I hope not to be the ghost of christmas future.

There is a piece of paper by Mr. Kafka that says, I quote from memory, that revolutions evaporate as a new bureaucracy appears that wants to domesticate them. And so many years later it still seems to me a very correct explanation to portray all that is happening in Catalonia. The revolution has not succeeded as it should, but the effects it has had are remarkable, and the perception is becoming clearer of the impact it will have when it has just succeeded, there are those who are trying to moderate it. From within. Controlling it. Domesticating it.

Obviously, the pandemic favors this domestication insofar as the main asset of this revolution, the street, is inevitably stopped. But that's not enough. Since October 3, there has been a conscious, tenacious task of a part of political independentism that wants to prevent things like the October Day or Urquinaona from happening again. Or that he intends, in the manner of the Chinese emperors, that the revolutionary scenery of the square be put at the service of his palace maneuvers, more or less as the Tsunami did. The social commotion created by the existence of political prisoners and exiles has contributed greatly to this purpose in the last three years, but now a momentous moment is approaching: the first truly regional elections after the proclamation of independence. And it is in this context that the patience of those who know the Catalan sottogoverno first hand has definitely exploded, because they work there every day. And they are the ones who make this warning to us.

There is still a long way to go before the elections and we are not playing everything there, not by a long shot. But it is clear that there is a possibility that in February a government with an autonomous intention will be consolidated, based in independentism. And if that happens we will have entered another phase. The elections of December 21, 2017 were held in a state of shock and all the pro-independence activists claimed that they were those for restitution. They have not been. I am not able to know to what extent they knew it, that they would not be, and to what extent the counter-revolution has been making this possible, all this. But that today the Catalan political class is further away from the republic than in December 2017 is a finding that no one can deny.

https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=ca&tl=en&u=https://www.vilaweb.cat/noticies/un-avis-a-temps-sobre-la-contrarevolucio-independentista/

https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=ca&tl=en&u=https://www.vilaweb.cat/noticies/la-impotencia-del-neoautonomisme-republica/
https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=&sl=ca&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.vilaweb.cat%2Fnoticies%2Ffeixisme-espantall-sostenir-regim-costa-erc-democrates%2F

(Sadly, Google Translate is still quite poor with Catalan.)

{{ Good news on the renewables front here - 'Scotland generated enough electricity from renewable sources last year to meet the equivalent of 90.1% of its total electricity consumption, according to latest figures.'- BBC News
At this rate wont be too many more years till we have got rid of carbon fuels altogether. Just need the rest of the world to catch up!}}

https://sourcenews.scot/robin-mcalpine-nicola-sturgeon-this-is-a-matter-of-the-integrity-of-scotland-as-a-nation/

90% renewable is amazing. But it seems to be coastline related: wind and ocean wave hydro. I don't think many countries can match that.

{{ Blue- Im not sure how much stock I put in his words. As before Im waiting to see how the process turns out- Sturgeon has referred herself for investigation. But Im suspicious of anything at moment in light of the leaked UK government plan to target, attack and undermine Sturgeon personally in an attempt to reduce the pro-independence movement.
But if the various commitess looking into it find she is guilty of something then same as any other MSP she should have to face the consequnces of that.But so far whats missing is any motivation for it.

Halfy- we've always had a lot of hydro- turns out mountains plus tons of rainfall is handy for hydro. }}

{{ The two main contenders in the leadership race for Scottish Labour have been responding to how they will deal with calls for a second referendum on independence.

Front runner Anas Sanwar said- "I think the most mature leadership we can have right now is to say to people that we need a period of calm, we need a period of healing. Rather than going back to the old arguments about Brexit and independence let's instead, for the next five years, the course of the next parliament, focus on making it the Covid recovery parliament rather than a constitutional debate parliament."

Now its a hedge your bets answer for me. He effectively rules it out for the length of the next Parliament, five years, but not after that. Its a kick the ball into the long grass strategy.
Now assuming we can get covid under control by the end of this year and some semblence of normality has returned, Im not sure he can hold that stance for a further four years.

His rival for the position, Monica Lennon said, "I think people want to know what we can do with the resources the Scottish parliament has now but I don't doubt the big debate that people still want to have in their homes is about will there be a referendum in the future. I don't believe in Scottish independence but I do understand people maybe have frustrations, things are not settled and I'm not in politics to tell people what they can't have. I'll always respect democracy. We have to find out why this is such a polarising issue in Scotland, we can't just wish it away."

Bit more to pull apart here. She acknowledges its what people are talking about, and she hints that she would not stand in the way of it if it seems to be the democratic wishes of the people. But she also seems to think if she can work out what it is people are upset about she can somehow offset the desire for independence. That will be tricky when the problem is Westminster and a democratic deficit when it comes to Scotlands voice within the Union- as all those things are out the grasp of any Scottish party, which is precisely the problem.

Interestingly both of them to some degree are at odds with party leader Keir Starmer who heads Westminster Labour and who says, "I don't think there should be another referendum. I don't think a referendum is the right way forward. But I do accept that the status quo isn't working. I don't accept the argument that if the status quo isn't working, the next thing you do is going to a referendum. I think there are other things that you can do, other arguments that can be made in support of the United Kingdom."

Keirs plan is for further devolution within the Union. Problem there is if you give Scotland 80% or such of the full powers it would have being independent then folk just think, well if we run most of it already why not just do all of it?

But it all highlights a major problem Scottish Labour have had since the rise of the SNP to power- that the Scottish party has to take its instructions from the Westminister party and its often at odds with the Scottish branch of Labour. The previous arguments boil down to SNP bad. Indepedence bad. And all its done is moved them from the overwhelmingly dominant force in Scottish politics to fighting it out for who comes last in elections.

Its seems obvious that the two current contenders have finally cottoned onto this fact, and are tying to position Scottish Labour as less outright hostile to the idea, whilst at the same time positioning themselves as offering an alternative of some sort within the politics of Scotland. But Westminister Labour are still stuck on SNP bad, independence bad rhetoric. Something will have to give. }}

The thing is Petty, no UK Labour leader will come out and say they support a 2nd Independence referendum whether s/he does privately or not-it would be electoral suicide, how can you run to be elected as leader of the United Kingdom when you publicly say you could support breaking it apart? I think a Labour goverment would prefer to run a minority goverment than a coalition with the SNP if the cost is a 2nd referendum (Independece for Scotland is inevitable i.m.o the UK goverment will kick that can down the road as long as possible) a referendum that they would likely loose.

Ironically the more votes the SNP get the more votes the Tories seem to get in England.

Now I realise that for many in Scotland that will sound like Scotland isn't getting a fair say or its voice is being ignored, but I can tell you that many in England and Wales feel equally ignored by Westminister, for what its worth I know several Scots who live in England (but commute reguarly back to and from Scotland), and not a single one of them supports Scottish Independence, whilst some agree the politcal arguments may make sense none are convinced the financial arguments do (indeed, it seems most of them moved down to England fro work), and despite what many in the SNP claim the three nations of Great Britain really aren't all that different from each other culturally.

Independence is likely eventually but I don't think in the immediate future is for the best (if you think Brexit and the Covid pandemic was bad for the economy, imagine how complicated breaking up the Union will be), nor am I particularly convinced by many of the SNP's finacial arguments (the currency union won't happen, the UK will still control Faslane etc, and hasn't the price of oil collapsed in recent years? I know you are moving more and more to renewable energy up there though).

Like it or not, many of the SNP's arguments about independence are very similar to Brexit....and correct me if I'm wrong but more people voted for Brexit in Scotland than they did the SNP is the last election (in numbers that is, not as a percentage)

Though the SNP's constant complaining and whining on TV 24/7 does seem to be swinging some in England in favour of Indepence, many left wing/labour voters etc in England (including myself) are fed up of being painted as nasty old backwater racists who are keeping poor wee scotland enslaved againist it's will, when Scotland gets hardly any immigration in comparison (all very well claiming to be a multicutural paradise when you don't have dozens of  Bradfords, Sloughs or Boston's which have changed out of all recognition demographically in recent decades due to an immigration policy the public had no say in-feeling like a stranger in you own town will give anyone pause for thought, and having concerns about the rate of immigration in a small island country dosen't necessarily make you a racist prick, especially if you are from a working class background and not in the posiistion to move the EU and take advantage of freedom of movement yourself), was an equal and willing partner in the Empire and benefits hugely from the Union and in some aspects punches far above its weight poltically, it really does feel sometimes like the SNP is trying to rewrite history and make Scotland seem like another Ireland when the situations are very very different.

I voted Remain, live in a Tory safe seat which has been continously Conservative since 1885 and wouldn't vote for them if you'd paid me to, I definitely don't feel represented by Westminister either and neither do the vast majority of my friends and family, where is our indepdence referendum? In my own personal epxerience much of the leave vote in 2016 wasn't a vote againist the EU but a vote against a goverment that seems ever more remote from its own people.

I think it's pretty much guranteed had the Brexit vote gone the other way in 2016 and England voted remain, whilst Scotland voted leave the SNP would dash full course ahead clamouring for indepence outside both.

David Cameron made it very clear a EU membership referendum was going to happen, all parties agreed to it and people in Scotland voted in full knowledge in 2014 that leaving the UK could mean leaving the EU then, or a few years later in the UK Referendum. Though from what I recall I don't remember EU membership being a particulalry burning issue in 2014.

Far from raising sympathy for Scotland, the SNP's constant whining and moaning is only turning many Left wing voters in England againist a legitimate poltical movement (I turn the TV over every single time Ian Blackford opens his gob to whine), i do think Scottish Independence is inevitable and probably for the best-but not right now, and when our countries do part ways I want it to be on good terms, but face it the UK govement will hold most of the cards, and I expect many in England will be leery of treating 8% of the population as an equal, when so many of our own regions are ignored by Westminster.

Blair made a bad move with evolution in 1997 i.m.o- England should have been granted regional parliaments of its own, the four nations of the UK wouldn't feel as far apart now nor so London centric i.m.o and were Scottish Indepdence to happen under those circumstances it would probably be handled with less bile and fear mongering on both sides.


Sorry for the rant.

Jut really rather fed up with some of the loathsome biased crap I've seen certain segments of the Scottish Indepdence movement spout online (to be fair it's mostly the nutjobs who seem to spend too long on twitter, which any movement seems to attract)

Not everyone in Scotland is a left wing SNP voter, and I can definitely assure very far from everyone in England is a brexit crazy tory voter.

I tend to agree with your points Malick, there is a lot of anti-English sentiments from the more extreme elements of the SNP and sometimes he does seem like a stuck record when Blackford stands up, but on the other hand he does have a point about the treatment the Scottish get, maybe if he said the odd positive comment you wouldn't think he hated all Sassenachs, but he is at the epicentre of Tories and he has to fight to be heard over the baying Etonians shouting insults. I totally understand what you mean about the Bradfords and Sloughs which are like entering a Pakistani town where nobody speaks English, there are mosques on every corner and the town has become Islamified. Because they have an enclave which doesn't mix with the British they grow up in a parallel universe, and that is hard to take in your own country, and it isn't racist to admit it. These fears about being taken over has led directly to Brexit.
Going back to Scotland I think the Scottish people should have the choice to stay in Europe and have their own say in there own matters, and people in the North should have more say in their own matters because as you say its not multi-cultural heaven, there are pockets of Islamic/Pakistani ghettos which do not integrate and don't want to, and that is a problem. It needs sorting otherwise racism is going to get worse.

Best way to solve the ghetto problem is wait until they open a restaurant, then go in there and give it a positive rave on Yelp. The extra business will attract shopkeepers to open, and before long you've got an integrated neighborhood that has a foreign flair that nobody wants to completely lose.

no UK Labour leader will come out and say they support a 2nd Independence referendum whether she does privately or not-it would be electoral suicide, how can you run to be elected as leader of the United Kingdom when you publicly say you could support breaking it apart? - Malick

{{That is certainly the problem. Thing is for Labour to be the govt of the Uk they need those Scottish MP's, they need the seats, and they wont get those Scottish MP's while both branches of the party are in such clear disagreement and contradict each other all the time. A party that seems fractured and split never wins votes.
But if Scottish Labour go hardline anti-independence, anti giving the people  a choice they wont get the seats here, if Westminster Labour become pro giving the people the choice they wont get the votes in England. They are in a Catch 22.

'England and Wales feel equally ignored by Westminister'

I dont doubt it, some form of devolved regional government seems sensible there, if Scotlnd gets independence Im in favour of having the same here, with regions having much more powers and far less centralised government. But being independent is the first step towards achieving that.

'I know several Scots who live in England'

Likewise I know several English (my older brother is married to one, my nieces therefore are half English) most came here for one of three things in my experience- to get a more left of centre based government (free prescriptions, an NHS not half sold to private companies, nationalised water etc) or they came here to go to university and stayed because they liked it,or they came to work in areas like health where the pay is and benefits are a little better.
But Independence would not lead to any cutting of personal ties, in fact I think it will heal many rancorous isues that have arisen on both sides as a result of the tug of war over independence.

'nor am I particularly convinced by many of the SNP's finacial arguments (the currency union won't happen, the UK will still control Faslane etc, and hasn't the price of oil collapsed in recent years?'

You dont have to be. This is from the Mccrone report, it was commissioned by the Labour government of the time in 1974, and then was filed as secret and didnt come to light until 30 years later when the SNP uncovered it.

"It must be concluded therefore that revenues and large balance of payments gains would indeed accrue to a Scottish Government in the event of independence provided that steps were taken either by carried interest or by taxation to secure the Government 'take'. Undoubtedly this would banish any anxieties the Government might have had about its budgetary position or its balance of payments. The country would tend to be in chronic surplus to a quite embarrassing degree and its currency would become the hardest in Europe with the exception perhaps of the Norwegian kroner. Just as deposed monarchs and African leaders have in the past used the Swiss franc as a haven of security, as now would the Scottish pound be seen as a good hedge against inflation and devaluation and the Scottish banks could expect to find themselves inundated with speculative inflow of foreign funds."

Now it was written in 1974, and as you point out oil was worth a lot more back then now, and the price is indeed much lower. But heres the thing with oil, even when the price is lower all it means is you arent making as much, but its still making a profit. If you look at the UK top 10 exports list you will see that crude petroleum is the UK's third biggest export today, and refined petroleum the eigth largest export.
Westminster doesnt iclude the oil take in its calculations of Scotlands weath as all revenue goes to the Treasury. McCrone, the '74 report writer was still alive and well at the time of the last referendum and was called to give evidence on Scotlands finances in front of a Scottish Parliament sub-committe. He said that if the oil was taken into account Scotlands GDP would instantly improve by 20%.
But the most important thing is the SNP government have been shaping the economy away from reliance on oil for over a decade now. With the loss of heavy industry under Thatcher the economy like most of the Uk has shifted from manufacturing to services. Edinburgh has a strong and growing financial centre. Glasgow is a hub for the arts and for designers.
Rural economies have been boosted by an increase in fish and shell fishing and large fish farms (two of the biggest employers in my area are the two fish farms in the area, and an Amazon warehouse. Neither are fun jobs, but they both pay pretty well, especially the fish farm ones).
And the SNP invested in infrastructure. In my small rural town alone since the SNP came to power we've had a new state of the art secondary school built, the complete renovation and doubling in size of the primary school round the corner from me, the oldest school in town is currently in the middle of an entire interior refurbishment, upgrade and expansion (the original exoterior is alisted building). The centre piece of the town and its biggest venue and public space was knocked down and completely remade with a modern building with gyms, a full theatre and hall, library, cafe and other facilities with stunning views over the Clyde. And the Victorian pier is half way through rennovation after decades of prior neglect.
All of this provides work for tradesmen of all stripes.
Weve moved from oil dependency to renewable, 90% of the country's entire electircty use is renwable energy under SNP policy and foresight. We are one of the world leaders in the technology. And our universities and science labs are similary still among some of the best in the world. We even have someof the worlds biggest software developers, Rockstar being the most famous. But long before others the SNP working with the games industry created Univeristy degrees in games design and programming, tailored to what the industry needed. It didnt happen by chance.
And theres only just over 5 million of us, we have a decent basis for being a modest to comfortable nation comparable to toher northern European countries of similar population and resources.
That its why the SNP keep winning elections, people can see a difference in their own town after Labour and Tories presided over decline when they were in power and control.
Not perfect, just better.  
They can feel it in their pocket too with lower tax rates for the lowest on the economy and stuff like free prescriptions and education. They watch on the news every night about some other cut in the English NHS, or massive waiting lists,or shortages of staff, and think well its better than that and Tories.
People dont vote SNP on mass for independence, a large chunk do as a main motivator, but many, many more vote simply for better governance, and are simply therefore inclinced to think we'd probably be better just doing it all ourselves if pressed on the question. But its not their main reason for voting SNP.

'the UK will still control Faslane etc'

The Scottish Paliament already voted twice on the removal of Trident and its opposition to possessing nuclear bombs, polling consistently shows this to be a majority opinion in Scotland.
Were we to be independent Scotland would not have a nuclear fleet, or submarines, or air craft cariers. Rather the proposals is for a suitably sized soldiery, a modest airforce and a larger navy presence. Faslane would become both the main base of the Scottish Navy and a refuel and repair depot for international allies, at a price. Which is exactly what happens now and round the corner from me on Loch Striven where there is ananother  international refuling depot. So basically the same only without the nuclear component.
Scotland is strategly placed, and the north of Scotland and northern islands are used not just for extreme training but house much of the UK's radar, satelitte and detection posts. All these assets are bargaining chips in any seperation negotation of course. Becuase thats politics. But they are also part of Scotland uncalculated assets.

'if I'm wrong but more people voted for Brexit in Scotland than they did the SNP is the last election'

Well Brexit was a yes no question and the Scottish Parliament uses a form of proportional representation for its voting, with a list system. Its specificaly designed to make it as unlikely as possible for any one party to gain an overall majority- it was Labours safeguard against the SNP geting control and forcing through a referndum vote. Of course the SNP got such high votes that election they actually won a majority despite the odds. So its not really possible to compare directly as they are two entirely different voting methods.
As for the Brexit vote, in constituency terms, every single one of them in Scotland voted remain. Not one had a leave majority.

'are fed up of being painted as nasty old backwater racists who are keeping poor wee scotland enslaved againist it's will'

I'd genuinely like to understand this better. I have never met someone who has voted SNP, an I know lot of them, who do it out of any dislike or lack of fondness for the English people, particularly those of the  north of England, as there has been a long standing relationship between the working classes in both areas since the industrial age began. Most Scots have some family connection to England or at the least fond memories of holidays in Blackpool or something.

Everyone I know has a problem with Westminister, and no matter how we vote, or what we express as what we want, we have to take whatever England wants as there's more English than Scots. Thats not an issue of therefore hating the English, or blaming the English for being a larger country- that'd be mad- its simply an acknowledgment of fact, and that if we keep voting for the opposite of England on key nation changing issues and on political direction, we'd be better being independent and getting what we vote for. Its no more complex than that.
And it is Westminister not the English people who keeps Scotland back on independnce by not being honest about the finances and all the assets it provides to the Union, or even how Scotland would compare to other similar sized european nations. And by refusing us the rigth to decide if and when we wish to hold another referendum.

'much of the leave vote in 2016 wasn't a vote againist the EU but a vote against a goverment that seems ever more remote from its own people.'

I wouldnt disagree with that.

'whilst Scotland voted leave the SNP would dash full course ahead clamouring for indepence outside both.'

But this is a bit silly. It was not the SNP who decided- they advocated staying, they have been pro-EU since inception. But  the referendum results in Scotland would have been to remain still. So it would also be political suicide for them to take the opposite position, were they to arbitarily decide to change their entire position after decades of being very visibly pro-EU.

' from what I recall I don't remember EU membership being a particulalry burning issue in 2014.'

Youve got to be kidding. It was one the biggest central pieces in the Unionist armoury, they were relentless on it. That and Cameron saying we could not use the pound as a transition currency were the two biggest arguments that swayed the outcome. And there wasnt a huge dela in it, 52 to 48 percent.
From Cameron down they all said that the only way Scotland could secure its place within the EU was to vote for the Union, it was the only guarantee of remaing in the EU. We were told by the same Tories who took us into Brexit that voting Yes for independence would lead to Scotland being forced out the EU and how disastrous that would be for us, destroynig our export industry and are farming industry. Only by voting for the Union could we reamin safe inthe EU.

It was such a big point that it is the central legal reason the SNP gave parliament for consituting a material change in circumstances when Scotland voted to remain in the EU got taken out anyway, its oneof the main arguments justifiyng having a 2nd referendum.

'I turn the TV over every single time Ian Blackford opens his gob to whine'

So does most of Scotland, he's generally known as either a balloon, a dour presbytarian git, or a bawbag, depending where you sit on the political spectrum. He's leader of the Westminister wing to keep him out of Scotland and its politics and away from the main SNP. You see the SNP are essentially useless in Parliament, in that they dont have a massive point to being there most of the time. They dont vote on non-Scottish issues, they abstain on english only votes, or welsh only. And they cant make policies or change anything. But thats not why they are there anyway. No they are there as simple poltical pressure by virtue of being there physically in numbers. Their representation is symbolic of a democratic desire for independence. But its plitically tactical. He is a powerul figure with a certain section of the upper party and unions, but utterly unsuited to be leader of the party of First Minister, but he needs something with an important sounding position, a lot of publicity, and tthe appearence  of power to exert- it nueters him from taking a stab at leader of the party by putting him in the Wesminster role.

'all very well claiming to be a multicutural paradise when you don't have dozens of  Bradfords, Sloughs or Boston's which have changed out of all recognition demographically in recent decades'

Scotland has less immigration by number, but the SNP have long championed for more as like many other nations we have an ageing population, we need to import young blood. Scotlands popualtion has never really recovered since the Highland Clearences. But immigration is not devolved. But like the rest of the UK we have seen a large and noticeable increase- we have northern europeans, Phillipino, Italian, indian/pakistani, Asian, African- all the same groups as England, its just its our share of the load as a percentage of our population. You get the same percentage of immigrants, its just thats a lot more people in England.
But its not just that, as you say in England you get entire streets of one immigrant group, english is a second language, they nearly all follow a non UK religion, they dress differently and dont even try to integrate.
In Scotland the policy is to spread immigrants out in small groups, even to rural and island communities. Thats why even my small town in a rural location can see a noticeable broading of races. But they make up therefore a smaller precentage of the totla community popualtion. Nor are they housed near each other or all in one street or block of flats. When a group of immigrants were all housed in the same two tower blocks in Glasgow it was considered a political scandal here.
The SNP also set up in each area contacts for them to help them integrate, learning better english, how the money works and paying the bills and taxes that sort of thing. And because they are in smaller groups there is little choice but for both sides to interact, especially in small communities where often there are even groups or reach out programs from within the local population itself. So there are policy decision besides just the raw numbers that I think have been better handled here.


'it's mostly the nutjobs who seem to spend too long on twitter, which any movement seems to attract'

Yup and thats your mistake, your extrapolation that out to everyone who votes SNP. But its not whose keeping the SNP in power by clear margins, those folk are a minority, a fringe. The people who keep them in power are those who think they are doing a better job than anyone else whose had a go so far. Is it perfect? Of course not we had the same recessiona s everyone else, the same austerity for a decade and services cut. There have been problems in education and in the NHS. And that wa sbefore a global pandemic. But were in shit times and circumstances now and for a long time, since austerity, and the pertinent question when your in the shit is who seems most competent to at lest keep your head above the shit line and find a way out. And compared to the Tories right now, and Boris, or Scottish Labou playing musicla leaders and unable to agree on major policy, they look a lot more competent than the rest. Which probably explains the sutained lead in the opinion polls shown for independnce and voting intentions at the upcoming elections. }}